Hi,

Pending another trip to my local dealer, can anyone suggest the best neutral sounding speaker cable to use with a Naim CDX2 Nac 202 and Nap 200 system to B&W 804 speakers. I will need 2 x 4m lengths and have a budget to £300.

Having recently purchased the Naim “kit” I have been using my old Chord Odyssey bi wire cable. I know that Bi wire is not recommended with Naim Amps and the Chord silver cable does seem to make the overall presentation, extra lively!

As mentioned I am looking for a neutral, open sounding cable.

Thanks

Well the standard recommendation will of course be Naim's own NACA5 - at just under £10/m you shouldn't pay much more than £100 for your needs including termination, leaving plenty of spare cash for music: everyone's a winner :D

Steve.

Thanks Steve, I know this is the obvious choice and this cable was in my original demo. I decided not to buy it then as I found it a bit edgy!

The NACA5 is obviously suited to the Naim style of presentation but I was rather hoping to find some cable that kept the characteristics that I like, fast punchy presentation with a deep sound stage, but maybe curbed the slight edginess.

My old system was from the Arcam FMJ range, the electronics being more laid back in their presentation, I used some more vibrant interconnects and speaker cable to liven things up a bit; I guess I am looking for the reverse with the new Naim system.

Thanks for your suggestion other opinions will be very welcome.

Lee

I was using harmonic technoligy cables with my naim system,the system has changed but the cables have stayed

Try and buy a NAPSC for the 202 first as that will take off a fair amount off the edginess. Then try NACA5.

Hi,

Pending another trip to my local dealer, can anyone suggest the best neutral sounding speaker cable to use with a Naim CDX2 Nac 202 and Nap 200 system to B&W 804 speakers. I will need 2 x 4m lengths and have a budget to £300.

Having recently purchased the Naim “kit” I have been using my old Chord Odyssey bi wire cable. I know that Bi wire is not recommended with Naim Amps and the Chord silver cable does seem to make the overall presentation, extra lively!

As mentioned I am looking for a neutral, open sounding cable.

Thanks

Well give the Mogami 2972 a go. Its just half the price of Naim NACA5 and sounds a bit more soft.

Hi,

As mentioned I am looking for a neutral, open sounding cable.

Thanks

I would highly recommend DNM speaker cable. I first substituted it for NACA5 with a CDS3/252/250.2 and found it to be much cleaner, subjectively faster sounding, and totally devoid of graininess. I was convinced from moment one that the overall presentation was far better than NACA5 which, as a good Naim sheep, I had used for the preceeding two years. The Naim kit has since been replaced by Crimson 710 preamp and 640E monoblock amps, which I have raved about elsewhere on this forum. (Neither my DNM nor my Crimson recommendations have received an enthusiastic reception over at the Naim forums.) If you get a chance, you should definitely audition it, at about the same price as NACA5. If you don't like it, you will easily flog it off on either eBay or Audiogon as there are many out there who believe in it as I do.

Norman

I second the DNM recommendation, I use it with my 82/hicap/250 and used to use it on my 102/180. I does all the 'good' naim stuff while reducing the slightly sharp high end and also (imo, of course) giving more graduation to the bass - I always felt that naca5 gave a bit of a lumpy bass.

However, I would agree with Milan and get the napsc first, it could do everything you need it to.

Cheers

Thanks for the advice, sounds as though I need to find yet more rack space to accomodate the NAPSC!

Lee

I second the DNM recommendation, I use it with my 82/hicap/250 and used to use it on my 102/180.

Hi Callahan,

Interesting to read that you have been successful with older Naim kit, which is reputed to be much more tricky to match up with non-Naim speaker wire (NACA4 or NACA5). The last time I recommended DNM on a similar thread over at the Naim forums, I was severely chastised by a member, a dealer I believe, who said that the high capacitance of DNM speaker wire "shut down Naim amps without even trying". The thread originator was looking for alternatives for his Nait 3. Obviously, such a comment will tend to keep the forum members in line. I don't have the background to dispute such a statement, but I will be seeing Crimson's Peter More this weekend and hope to learn more about that criterion regarding amplifier design, as he uses DNM interconnect wire in his amplifiers and universally recommends the speaker wire for use with his kit.

Norman

Hmm, my Naim amps musn't have been trying then ;)

I've also used two different nait 3's with the dnm and have never had a problem, driving B&W P4's, Shahinian Arc's and Arcaydis Concept2's, so pretty decent speakers. Soon to be Obelisks too, so the dnm must be doing something right.

Don't quote me on this, but naim have 'unofficially' told me that dnm is fine with their amps. It's only certain cables (Kimber was one) that can cause problems, but please don't blame me if your amp melts. :D

Cheers

ps. as a footnote, I still think naca5 is good speaker cable and a bit of a bargain at the price. I just prefer what the dnm does in my system.

I had understood that the speaker wire warnings were primarily related to Litz type designs, which could cause the amp to oscillate. When I first got my Nait 5i, I hooked it up to Audio Quest Volcanos, which were a Litz design and never had a problem. Supposedly the current "Reference Series" and Nait 5i do fine with such designs. Interesting, Callahan, that your Nait 3 didn't self destruct with the dreaded DNM.

Norman

Mogami 2972 costs a little more than NACA5 in the UK if purchased terminated from a dealer.

Mine cost £120 for 2 x 3m terminated lengths but it was worth it over the NACA5 I was using beforehand. However, in an all-Naim system I'd use NACA5 or Townsend ISOLDA @ £55/m + £100 for termination.

Dear motobug,
Please don't take this the wrong way but,
it always amazes me when people buy a Naim system and then come on the forums and ask "what cable can I buy to take the edginess away?"
You see it seems to me that you have spent a lot of money on a system that you don't appear to be fully happy with sound wise.
If you had the demo with Naca 5, then you heard the system as it was meant to sound(as recommended by Naim).
You then proceed to try and alter that sound with a different choice of speaker cable(not really recommended by Naim)
FWIW, I believe that speaker cables do sound different. I too have a Naim system and initially tried QED silver cables, absolutely no bass. I dashed back to the shop and swapped it for Naca 5 and harmony was restored.
It was once explained to me that all cables are a compromise and that some let more of the signal through than others due to differing electrical properties,
With this in mind, I can't help feeling that maybe you are trying to strangle your expensive Naim amps because you don't like their forward presentation(usually more noticeable on heavily compressed and bass light recordings)
Which rather begs the question, do you think you may be better off with different kit?
I hope you don't take offence at what I have said, it's just my humble opinion that you may be trying to defeat the object so to speak.

Regards
MM.

Don't quote me on this, but naim have 'unofficially' told me that dnm is fine with their amps. It's only certain cables (Kimber was one) that can cause problemsFrom Naim's product liability PoV, it must be infinitely safer to make a blanket official statement not to use any speaker cable other than their own.

Thanks to everyone who has offered some constructive advice. Machine Man, you are very welcome to your opinion.

I am 90% delighted with my new system and my objective is to get the very best out of the equipment I have. I have been fortunate to arrange a back to back test in my home with the Naim Cable, Kimbers 8TC and I obviously have the existing Chord cable as a reference. Lets see what comes out of that.

Once again thanks for your comments.

Lee

Hi Lee
You beat me to my response. I have tried Chord Odyssey 2, NACA5 and Kimber 8TC in my system which has undergone some upgrades/downgrades/changes over the years. The results as I found them (with respect to speaker cables) is that the NACA5 sits between the Chord and Kimber. The Chord give a sharper and more edgy kind of sound whilst the 8TC produced a much rounder warmer sound. The NACA5 seems to sit between the 2 and gives me all that I could want soundwise although I do wish that it was a bit more wieldy. 7m of it on each side is more than I need but is what is recommended as an ideal length and the spare cable is not pretty. Anyway, I can't see if when the lights are down at night.
Happy listening with your trials and I am envious of all your new gear!
Raphael

Following advice on this thread a while ago, I substituted NACA 5 with Van Damme cable. It was supposed to be a short-term solution but it's amazing with my Naim / PMC system. It is incredibly cheap and I bought 14 metres of the stuff, professionally terminated with quality plugs for £36.00 (including delivery!) The quality is superb and has lead me to suspect that the HiFi industry is playing us for fools.

Try it!

moomaloo, model number, sizes, pics and where from ?

I know, im very demanding :D

cheers!

Trancera

Maplins sell Van Damme here :-

http://www.maplin.co.uk/module.aspx?TabID=1&ModuleNo=13295&doy=12m3#spec

I recently bought some of the 1.5mm for AV use - it's well made, very flexible & costs peanuts at the current offer price.

Can't comment on sound quality for hi-fi use though - you would no doubt want to use the thicker gauges anyway.

The BBC use Van Damme cables so .....

Van Damme cable. It was supposed to be a short-term solution but it's amazing with my Naim / PMC system.
punchy and kicks a lot, I bet ;-)

moomaloo, model number, sizes, pics and where from ?

I know, im very demanding :D

cheers!

Van Damme 2.5mm studio grade. From John at Orchid Electronics - Superb service. Do a Google search for the URL and send the guy an e-mail. It's a simple round profile screened cable and is very flexible (unlike NACA...!)

moomaloo, are there no capacitance / inductance issues with your Naim kit?!

You could of course also try the Avondale cables, which are available on a sale-or-return basis. You'll need to wait for these though as Les is under the weather at the moment (see thread elsewhere).

Steve.

The BBC use Van Damme cables so .....
And IIRC Linn wire their speakers internally with the stuff. Some other speaker companies do, too.

moomaloo, are there no capacitance / inductance issues with your Naim kit?!

No, none whatsoever. Naim are a great company. I love them to bits, but some of their claims are utter balls. Cable is cable is cable. It's just 'wires'. Don't sweat the small stuff!

years ago i changed from naca4 to audioquest indigo bi-wired.it sounded better than the naim wire.i run this for about 10 years at mostly high volumes,and it had no adverse on my nap 250.
gd

Well give the Mogami 2972 a go. Its just half the price of Naim NACA5 and sounds a bit more soft.
The 2972 is 4 core. Curious to learn what the preferred way for them to be wired up/terminated is?

No, none whatsoever. Naim are a great company. I love them to bits, but some of their claims are utter balls. Cable is cable is cable. It's just 'wires'. Don't sweat the small stuff!

And maybe their dealers are thinking that too. I went into Audio T in Swindon on Saturday and they were very happy not to recommend NAC A5 and said that they had 'never known' instability problems with Naim amplifiers and other makes of speaker cable. In fact they recommended Chord.
Just to be sure I did check on the Naim website and Audio T is an official Naim dealer and so they must be telling the truth mustn't they?

Guy

The 2972 is 4 core. Curious to learn what the preferred way for them to be wired up/terminated is?

Bi wire, or parallel up a couple of cores at each end.

Thanks for the advice, sounds as though I need to find yet more rack space to accomodate the NAPSC!

Lee

Lee,

The napsc is supposedly quite noisy so should be kept as far away from other components as possible ie. on the floor, tucked away, definitely not on your rack.

Keith

I'd suggest trying a Hi-Line.
Now I know it's not a speaker cable:rolleyes:, but it just might have the desired effect.