Kicking and screaming I might add...

Had a rare opportunity to try a Roku Soundbridge 1001 (with the latest software rev), an Airport Express with Airtunes and a Squeezebox 3 last week.

The Setup was a Gigabit (wired) link from an upgraded 2Gb Intel Mac Mini running the latest iTunes into a Linksys WAG354G Router and a 20 meter unbroken Cat5a link into the living room which plugged into each device. I didn't bother with wireless as range is an issue.

The rest of the system you should know by now. Micromega DAC feeding a pair of ATCSCM100As via CA2 preamp. I spent a weekend listening to each and tried them all.

I initially flirted with the Audio Outs on each but they were all pretty horrid -- especially the Airport (muted and low signal gain) and the Squeezebox 3 (hashy and spitty). The Rocku was slightly less grainy due to rolling off the top end. None were sounding acceptable.

When fed optically into the DAC1 the sound was fantastic. Played side-by-side, Apple Lossless rips of my CD collection were slightly different (but marginally) from the Micromega Drive 3 into the DAC1. I put this down to a better quality connection via the dedicated AES/EBU feed. The Micromega DAC1 has AES fo CD transport. Coax for the FM Tuner (!) and TOSLink SP/DIF Optical. All DAC inputs are now used. For Airtunes I used a Toslink>3.5mm plastic snap-on adaptor

Going optical not only elevated sound quality, but evened out the differences so that between all three players there was no sonic difference whatsoever. I tried a 3m £4 cable Toslink from eBay and a reportedly £99 1m optical cable with fancy looking connectors from a fellow geek. Both cables sounded (and looked) identical.

If I wanted a display I'd go for the Squeezebox as it appears bigger but I prefer to control my iTunes from any of the proliferating laptops and Mobile Phones in the house. Plus its one less box as the Airport also acts as an 802.11g repeater which we need. PLus I can have different streams going to different machines -- all fed by the same iTunes database. No need for SlimServer. iTunes' Music Sharing feature is excellent.

So an £80 Airport Express it is then. It sits on a wall socket out of the way and is invisible. Network Cable in Optical Cable out. Great tunes. Sorted. No need for anything else. Small, tidy, efficient use of resources. Sounds identical to everything else I tried. Can't be arsed with worrying about anything else. Chuffed.

EDIT: Everything associated with the Internet needs a killer app to drive it and in this case I reckon Internet Radio is the killer app... or certainly Pandora. When I'm working even driving an iTunes playlist is distracting and shuffle is too random (Arvo Part: Arbos followed by RATM: Bullet in the back of the head -- was a jarring example yesterday). Internet Radio really lets one drill into a subgenre of a musical category and leaves the machine to choose for you. I'm sold.

Sounds like you've got things sorted.

I'll be doing something similar in a month's time or so, and i've also thought the Airport Express is the way to go. My DAC (an Arcam BB500) has more inputs than you can wave a stick at, so i'll be able to add the airport and avoid the internal DAC on it.

My music is currently served from a G4 server so I can go any route without much hassle. Keeping it within the apple family is probably the easiest option though.

Cesare

Fox,

On the SB you can control the device from the myriad of web accessible things you own, and also the random play function can be restricted by genre as well, thus preventing Ice T's KKK bitch following songs of praise favourites when the vicar is round for tea (or facilitating it, pending how mischeivous one feels)

S

The SB3 can also act as a wifi "repeater" as you put it.

Andrew

...the SB3 is also double the price for what is effectively a flourescent display.

And.......................

You can have VU meters and all sorts on it, and in big writin so you can read it across the room, your not a slave to a kompewta as its got a remote control............

S

Can it be programmed to disply "NaimNet is for weenies?"

ps the mobile phone seems to be doubling duty as a fine iTunes remote. Bluetooth seems to reach where 802.11g doesn't. Didn't like the SB remote, not as outright nasty as the Apple one but really not at all reflecting the sleek curves of the SB3 -- its main letdown.

Can it be programmed to disply "NaimNet is for weenies?"


Yes, it can as luck would have it..............there's legions of trainspotters writing bizarre little add-ons, which is nice.........

S

Yes, it can as luck would have it..............there's legions of trainspotters writing bizarre little add-ons, which is nice.........

S

Indeed being able to listen to BBC "listen again" stuff using the AlienBBC plug-in is a great feature (shame the bitrate sucks mind). No hassle, and streaming straight to my hifi.

You'll take my squeezebox from my cold dead fingers, etc etc...
--
tom

the ability to play 'pandora' on the SB2 and SB3 make it a no-brainer for me.

yes i tried Pandora with the Airport Express. Works well and is as you say a no-brainer for those no-brainer days

Lack of a display is a serious compromise IMO. My Airport can be temperemental to say the least if used for Airtunes. Mine gives me music about 40% of the time. Experience suggests that if it's output sounds the same as your CD player, look at the CD player or the rest of the system and get it fixed.

Lack of a display is a serious compromise IMO. My Airport can be temperemental to say the least if used for Airtunes. Mine gives me music about 40% of the time. Experience suggests that if it's output sounds the same as your CD player, look at the CD player or the rest of the system and get it fixed.

Which is why a gigabit connection is best for streaming applications... doesn't compete for your 802.11g's 56mbp/s line.

I have too many display options... phones, PSP, PDAs and laptops... Leave them alone and they breed like rats....

Fortunately unlike poor old merkin here I can set up a network properly and I don't suffer from his debilitating overactive audio imagination... Whatever keeps you happpy though... eh gramps?

I've been using an Airport Express as a repeater for around 18 months now, and it's great. The fact that it can do this and serve music makes it good value. Audio quality from the line-output isn't wonderful, and I might have to find a cable that will go into the back of my Opus 21 (which has a digital input)... can you give me more info about the source of the cables - I'd need a coax digi in at the back of the Opus, and whatever works for the AEx. TA.

yes i tried Pandora with the Airport Express. Works well and is as you say a no-brainer for those no-brainer days


Hi Fox

Do you mean you can use Airport Express with Pandora?

It would be interesting for me to know if you can as I haven't bought a music streaming device yet.

I must have a remote and a screen though, as the PC is on another floor of my house.

Hi Fox

Do you mean you can use Airport Express with Pandora?

It would be interesting for me to know if you can as I haven't bought a music streaming device yet.

I must have a remote and a screen though, as the PC is on another floor of my house.

Yep. Easy. For now you can use AirFoil (http://www.rogueamoeba.com/airfoil/) to deliver Pandora via Airtunes. The next version reportedly allows this as native but whether that's due to an official hook-up with iTunes or Pandora adding its functionality off the back of AirFoil or similar code I do not know.

Something like a PSP works OK as a WiFi controller for these things if you're used to the controllers on a PSP. But any WiFi enabled PDA will do just as well...

For a while I was tempted by the SqueezeBox as its a nice bit of techno-bling. But it was distracting me from the obvious... Its repeating tecnology already in place. i.e. I want the streamed content without the visible box.

Can you give me more info about the source of the cables - I'd need a coax digi in at the back of the Opus, and whatever works for the AEx. TA.

Here you go (http://stores.ebay.co.uk/MHP-Computer-Services). You need an optical>optical connection for the Airport Express. SB3 and Roku and other appliances offer Coax Digital -- but if you have a spare TosLink DAC then it makes sense to go with Airtunes.

I want the streamed content without the visible box.
You sound like a woman - "I want music but I don't want any speakers" ;-)

Well it could be worse. Wooden cheeks. ;-)

pinnochio?

I find real women like the wooden sides, and real men like the sound ;-)

and obese ;-)

My personal experience is that wired via optical creates a great sound. I used to use a VNC type affair with the lappy but now have a VGA output to the TV so can use front row. In essence I have everything a squeeze box can offer for the price of a second hand meridian dac and an optical lead.

I use it for what its good for, general background music or for radio.

I would argue that with an optical output on an mac you could reasonably do with out the express (Unless as fox does you need it for a booster)

I would argue that with an optical output on an mac you could reasonably do with out the express (Unless as fox does you need it for a booster)

I was thinking about getting another Mini and quitting the Denon 2900 DVD but the 2900 has a better picture into the Infocus Projector when driven via component vs the Mini's HDMI (which goes against the theory -- until you speak to people in broadcast), plus the Denon's been made region-free which is nigh on impossible with the Mini's CW-8124 drives -- so the reign of the dedicated appliance isn't over just yet.

Plus the Apple remote is just plain nasty...

I got away from the apple remote. I had to as the TV is in a different room to the iMac so no line of sight.

I got the very new and very handy keyspan frontrow remote. It too is pretty nasty but it works up to ten metres with walls in the way. So handy.

All I am waiting for patiently is for apple to sort out frontrow so it can run on a different screen, at the moment I have to goto to the iMac and change to mirroring, which kind of detracts from the whole thing.

Yesterday evening I connected my IPTV box to my Quad 99 CD-P digital preamp, bvilliant...
Too bad Quads system remote doesn't work, you need to bring out the CDP remote...(also looking for a web radio tuner now)

Incidentally keyspan do the 'express' which plugs into your airport express to act as a remote.

I was thinking about getting another Mini and quitting the Denon 2900 DVD but the 2900 has a better picture into the Infocus Projector when driven via component vs the Mini's HDMI (which goes against the theory -- until you speak to people in broadcast), plus the Denon's been made region-free which is nigh on impossible with the Mini's CW-8124 drives -- so the reign of the dedicated appliance isn't over just yet.

Plus the Apple remote is just plain nasty...

This will allow any DVD drive to play any region on almost any platform:

http://www.videolan.org/vlc/

It's a bit clunky but it works and it's free.

Andrew

Incidentally keyspan do the 'express' which plugs into your airport express to act as a remote.

This will almost certainly be built into the next generation of the Airport Express. The cost of adding this function would be about 35-60 cents.

Indeed, but if someone had the express now and wanted that functionality, it costs abut 25 quid.

However the software is a fucking mare of monolithic proportions.

Didn't you mean to say "fucking monumental"? Monolithic ICs are pretty fucking tiny.

I've heard about Keyspan's bloatware its mostly scripting as well which makes is run like molasses... and to be honest I really don't need another remote. (At last count there are 9 of the little sods in my living room) and the "all in ones" are either shite or bling or too big...

We are living in the dark ages of feudal remote controls -- all little fifedoms that don't talk to each other. Ghastly!

off topic, but I have been a little disappointed in my universal remote. Getting the thing to work properly is more difficult than I ever conceived of.

some standardisation would be nice.

I'm considering adding an AirPort Express to my newly acquired iTunes setup (MacBook, AirPort Extreme base-station, 5G iPod). Does it have an optical out?

I noticed that earlier in the discussion there was talk of getting the best sound out of the AirPort Express via a toslink connection into a DAC. But viewing photos on the Apple site, I can only see a standard analogue mini output, next to the USB and ethernet jacks.

This afternoon, I finally connected my MacBook to my Hi-Fi via a generic mini > RCA cable running from the MacBook's headphone jack into one of the front line-ins of my Yamaha HT receiver (which having a Pure Direct pass-through mode then feeds the signal directly into my Heed Luna preamp without, theoretically, any of the nasty HT amplifier sonic imprint).

For what it is, the sound is not too bad. I'm sure a better mini > RCA cable would have to help matters somewhat. Any suggestions? Or would a mini > toslink into the Yammy be optimal?

Nonetheless, I'm wondering if ultimately I can do better with AirTunes via an AirPort Express, optical cable, feeding into a cheap but cheerful standalone DAC.

In the short-term, I'm hoping to add a NAS HDD (400-500GB) of some sort, since my MacBook is just about full already with AAC files. This should provide enough space to house the majority of my CD collection for casual background listening, house-party shuffles or loading up the iPod. Serious listening, of course, will remain the exclusive domain of my CDP and TT.

Longer-term, funds permitting, I can envision adding one of those mega terra-byte NAS RAID-enabled wonders and re-ripping everything into Apple Lossless, and retiring my CDs into storage.

TIA, Dex

http://www.apple.com/airportexpress/specs.html

In a word yes the express does have optical out, but you need a little toslink adaptor which plugs into the mini jack port, I got mine on ebay for 3 quid.

this would be the best method for connecting to your hifi in my experience (I use optical out on the iMac into an old meridian dac I got on ebay for 60 quid but when I am in my new house I too will be getting an express

Just to say that I have had an Express for a year or so now and have had to the opportunity to compare it with the M Audio Firewire I originally bought for the purpose.

Both are able to provide a digital output which feeds my Dac - one using wireless, the other firewire. I have to say that the sound quality available from the M Audio solution is vastly superior to my ears and that confuses me. I would prefer to sell the M Audio and go wireless, but to my ears, it simply does not sound good enough that way for extended listening.

In a word yes the express does have optical out, but you need a little toslink adaptor which plugs into the mini jack port, I got mine on ebay for 3 quid.

Silly me, don't know how I missed it!

http://images.apple.com/airportexpress/images/specstop06072004.jpg

Looked at the spec sheet for the MacBook and discovered that its headphone out also does double-duty as an optical out.

So today I found a 5m Oehlbach optical cable (w/mini adaptor) in the clearance bin of my local mega-emporium for just 10 Euro.

Hooked it between the MacBook and my Yamaha receiver, utilising its onboard DAC. WOW, truly a vast improvement over the mini > RCA scenario!

Might be able to wait a little longer now before plunging into AirTunes. ;)

Thanks for the advice!

Dex