View Full Version : which of these decks isn't MUSICAL ?


jackal2513
19-10-10, 10:32 AM
which of these decks aren't very musical or involving (using your own definition of those words) ?

(you may pick more than one)

muzzer
19-10-10, 10:34 AM
All of them!!!!

whatsnext
19-10-10, 10:41 AM
which of these decks aren't very musical or involving (using your own definition of those words) ?

(you may pick more than one)

Twice posted and no decks mentioned. What you up to?

zener
19-10-10, 10:42 AM
Non of them!!! :D

barrymidd
19-10-10, 10:46 AM
I don't know them all but I have voted the ones I am not keen on. Arm and cart make more difference to sound quality anyway.

Robn
19-10-10, 10:48 AM
presume the decks you own or like are absent

muzzer
19-10-10, 10:49 AM
No WTA listed why's that then?

YNWOAN
19-10-10, 10:58 AM
Arm and cart make more difference to sound quality anyway.

Not in agreement with you on that I'm afraid (polite for; utter nonsense).

Basil
19-10-10, 11:00 AM
They'll each be as musical as the record being played.

Tony L
19-10-10, 11:01 AM
Woohoo! None of my decks are on the list!

Tony.

zener
19-10-10, 11:02 AM
have already been deemed non musical and arent worth inclusion:D

Basil
19-10-10, 11:04 AM
Woohoo! None of my decks are on the list!

Tony.

Decks?

How many have you got now?

How many decks does a man or woman need?

Joe Hutch
19-10-10, 11:04 AM
I'm going to buy all of them and do a series of blind tests to determine their relative musicalness.

jackal2513
19-10-10, 11:05 AM
No WTA listed why's that then?

this is part 1.

more to follow :)

deserter
19-10-10, 11:06 AM
This is getting silly (even tho I have voted!!!!!!!!)

One mans meat etc........... I sold an Amadeus as I thought it was impressive but unmusical; so what? Proves nowt - others like it. Me - if I had to choose - I would go for an LP12 over the WTA

Basil
19-10-10, 11:09 AM
I'm going to buy all of them and do a series of blind tests to determine their relative musicalness.

How are you going to define the 'musicalness'?

Tony L
19-10-10, 11:10 AM
Decks?

How many have you got now?

Four; a 301, a 124/II and two Lenco L70s. I've got way more tonearms!

Tony.

Joe Hutch
19-10-10, 11:10 AM
How are you going to define the 'musicalness'?

With a musicalness meter, obviously. Duh!

Basil
19-10-10, 11:13 AM
Not a 'Tune'o'meter' in conjunction with a 'foot-tap'o'meter, the final results being fed into a 'boogey'o'meter'?

Joe Hutch
19-10-10, 11:15 AM
That's legacy technology from the flat earth era. My musicalness meter has a USB drive!

Basil
19-10-10, 11:17 AM
So you're not worried about the shortcomings of the digital media throwing off the accuracy of the results?

Joe Hutch
19-10-10, 11:31 AM
That's a risk, but I've got a back-up in the form of a pair of Golden Ears.

sq225917
19-10-10, 11:45 AM
By musical i tend to understand the euphonic distortions introduced by the shit design of the LP12. So only early LP12's can ever be musical.

barrymidd
19-10-10, 11:45 AM
I was also wondering that :)
_____________________



Not in agreement with you on that I'm afraid.
Thank god for that. I cannot recall a single post I have read of yours that I agreed with. Don't you make some sort of Linn mod? In which case you would say that. You would also (as usual) be wrong.
FWIW. A good TT is conspicuous by its absence in the sound chain, thus leaving the arm/cart to perform whatever magic they are capable of.

jackal2513
19-10-10, 11:47 AM
They'll each be as musical as the record being played.

Stop the clock !

We have a superbrain in our midst ! ;)

YNWOAN
19-10-10, 11:52 AM
Thank god for that. I cannot recall a single post I have read of yours that I agreed with.

That's OK, I can't remember any of your posts either - but I imagine they have been most worthwhile ;).

(now, the difference between azimuth and overhang is................................do you know?)

PsB
19-10-10, 12:00 PM
which of these decks aren't very musical or involving (using your own definition of those words) ?

(you may pick more than one)

Clear post-purchase behaviour at work here.

dss
19-10-10, 12:07 PM
(now, the difference between azimuth and overhang is................................do you know?)

I know this one, has it got a Dolby on it is it?

DS

jackal2513
19-10-10, 12:12 PM
interesting so far

might have guessed that the Gryo would get a bit of a pasting

avole
19-10-10, 12:46 PM
The most musical table? Begins with SL ...

Basil
19-10-10, 12:50 PM
Stop the clock !

We have a superbrain in our midst ! ;)

Damn, my secret is out!

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a6/Talosian_keeper.jpg

And so it would seem, is someone else's!

Midlandaudiox
19-10-10, 12:55 PM
I think its time you let people know that you have a double identity jackal
I have pm ed Tony L and he has verified that you have a trade account under the name of Lotus340r
And that you are a dealer on PFM and eBay
Would you like to enlighten us all
To the purpose of these idiotic posts that you keep on starting?
Cheers
John

sean99
19-10-10, 12:56 PM
Shame his trade account isn't under the name "Mr Hyde"

jackal2513
19-10-10, 01:07 PM
I think its time you let people know that you have a double identity jackal
I have pm ed Tony L and he has verified that you have a trade account under the name of Lotus340r
And that you are a dealer on PFM and eBay
Would you like to enlighten us all
To the purpose of these idiotic posts that you keep on starting?
Cheers
John


Hi John.

None of this is a secret and is fairly well known and described in threads gone by. Look at all the items I have for sale. There are various other threads on here pertaining to each one from pre-purchase through to the decision to sell and upgrade. If I wanted to hide anything from anyone for any reason, don't worry, I would have done so.

As for the post, my apologies if the post offended you. It's only meant to be a bit of fun for a mid-week evening. No one is obligated to read or vote. :(

Joe Hutch
19-10-10, 01:09 PM
Shame his trade account isn't under the name "Mr Hyde"

Damn! My money was on him being Mick Parry.

Gromit
19-10-10, 01:21 PM
Damn! My money was on him being Mick Parry.

:D :D :D

Thanks Joe - that's one new MacBook screen/keyboard you owe me!!!!! (red wine interface).

jackal2513
19-10-10, 01:22 PM
Where is Mick these days ?

Still
19-10-10, 01:28 PM
Some say he's counselling the depressed (http://www.pinkfishmedia.net/forum/showthread.php?t=87295) (MMV).

grivois
19-10-10, 01:41 PM
I voted for all of them. Only idlers and DDs are musiqual...

Jonathan Ribee
19-10-10, 01:44 PM
maybe we could get them to form a choir

dss
19-10-10, 01:56 PM
Im waiting for Part III, The Return of the JVC is it.

DS

barrymidd
19-10-10, 01:56 PM
That's OK, I can't remember any of your posts either - but I imagine they have been most worthwhile ;).

(now, the difference between azimuth and overhang is................................do you know?)
I know but I'm not sure you do. I've been building/setting up TTs for 40yrs. You sound devoid of all knowledge that won't earn you a few bob from a mythical upgrade to an already outmoded TT. I am happy to argue with you any time.

Gaius
19-10-10, 05:18 PM
What are you up to Jackel?

Only a fool would say the LP12 isn't musical, maybe flawed but very musical; that was the theme of one of your many threads..

YN, the arm and cart make a huge difference, I mean the stylus IS the front end..

jackal2513
19-10-10, 05:33 PM
everyone loves a vote

29 tickets in and the Gyro tops the tables

Mullardman
19-10-10, 05:39 PM
Where is Mick these days ?

He's having a lie down. He's a bit depressed.

Joe P
19-10-10, 05:41 PM
Excellent. The P9 is trailing in the unmusical turntable poll.

Joe

Jack Barriere
19-10-10, 06:04 PM
Voted on the Roksan and still 8 is showing. 10 on the LP-12. Musicality is its ace in the hole.

muzzer
19-10-10, 06:07 PM
I voted for all of them.
Jack I think folk are just taking the piss.

jackal2513
19-10-10, 06:10 PM
I can see we are going to have to rerun this.... people aren't commited enough !!!!

Jack Barriere
19-10-10, 06:11 PM
Ah well. The Xerxes sounds like shit and a matter of fact all Roksan stuff sounds like crap.

jackal2513
19-10-10, 06:13 PM
not heard one but i thought that the P9 was more like a cd player than an actual cd player ?

Jack Barriere
19-10-10, 06:15 PM
P-9 with what cartridge?

jackal2513
19-10-10, 06:17 PM
the same cartridge that you put in the other deck that you are comparing it to

Jack Barriere
19-10-10, 06:32 PM
Apheta Fono MC or Exact Fono MM sounds CD like? Synergy at its best. I would never buy a P-9 as that money is in LP-12 land. But if your doing the Rega thing you would be mad not going with one of their MMs or the Apheta.

Yank
19-10-10, 06:51 PM
No one is obligated to read or vote. :(

Okay then I shan't.

Mike Reed
20-10-10, 03:17 AM
How long have I got to wait for the list with a Dansette on it?

Bill Haley and the Dansette were the epitome of symbiosis in '56/'57 :D

Steven Toy
20-10-10, 04:04 AM
I've heard a couple of well set up LP12s not time properly so can I vote for the LP12 or is that Not Allowed?

avole
20-10-10, 04:50 AM
You can only vote if you've heard all the turntables, preferably with the same cartridge and running through the same system.

In other words, this is an impossible poll to complete.

Joe P
20-10-10, 05:18 AM
Woo-hoo, the P9 is now in last place in the which-of-these-decks-isn't-very-musical poll.

Joe

sideshowbob
20-10-10, 05:23 AM
The one that's playing Pink Floyd.

Ed Rogerson
20-10-10, 05:36 AM
Woo-hoo, the P9 is now in last place in the which-of-these-decks-isn't-very-musical poll.


[Cheap shot]Because hardly anyone has heard one?![/Cheap shot]

Personally, I'm deriving much perverse pleasure from the fact that my deck of choice is considered to be the least musical.

johnfromnorwich
20-10-10, 05:42 AM
The one that's playing Pink Floyd.

Fortunately my unmusical Gyrorbe (apparently a hybrid of two unmusical decks - possibly incorporating the worst elements of both) is only used to play dissonant noise. That's probably why it sounds so good. I voted for all of them. Musicality resides in the performance, not the hardware.

Ed Rogerson
20-10-10, 06:05 AM
Fortunately my unmusical Gyrorbe (apparently a hybrid of two unmusical decks - possibly incorporating the worst elements of both)...

Fair point - I have also managed to incorporate the most unmusical elements of boths decks and added an unmusical arm for increased unpleasantness...

Blzebub
20-10-10, 06:15 AM
Hey Ed, my deck was winning at one point.

Ed Rogerson
20-10-10, 06:18 AM
Hey Ed, my deck was winning at one point.

Ah, such is the fickle nature of our pastime! I think people have looked into their hearts and thought "actually, the SME20 is a thoroughly musical deck".

sq225917
20-10-10, 07:02 AM
except, it's a poll for which deck isn't very musical

Making the Rega p9 the most musical deck in the group...

muzzer
20-10-10, 07:06 AM
Plus everyone is taking the piss.

Jack Barriere
20-10-10, 07:11 AM
I've heard a couple of well set up LP12s not time properly so can I vote for the LP12 or is that Not Allowed?

Definitely not. :o You are forgiven just for thinking about it. Maybe you heard with a Nima arm or some exotica cartridge.

Jack Barriere
20-10-10, 07:14 AM
except, it's a poll for which deck isn't very musical

Making the Rega p9 the most musical deck in the group...

Great deck but no Sondek with all the good shit on it.

jackal2513
20-10-10, 07:23 AM
Great deck but no Sondek with all the good shit on it.

Spoke to someone else who is also at a loss as to what linn are trying to do these days. He rated a basic naimed cirkus lp12 miles better than an SE which was just plain boring and all about detail and little else. I'd like to know what system its designed around ... maybe the full Klimax setup ?

barrymidd
20-10-10, 07:57 AM
A friend and fellow fish has a Sondek/Syrinx(from new)/Koetsu Rosewood. He upgraded it a few years back and after a couple of months he decided it wasn't as enjoyable as it was before and took the upgrades off. I must say I much prefered it without them and so does he. He does use an Avondale power supply though, which is better than the Lingo.

Ed Rogerson
20-10-10, 08:02 AM
except, it's a poll for which deck isn't very musical

Making the Rega p9 the most musical deck in the group...

Irony not travelling well today, obviously...

Blzebub
20-10-10, 09:21 AM
Ah, such is the fickle nature of our pastime! I think people have looked into their hearts and thought "actually, the SME20 is a thoroughly musical deck".

I think that must be what's happened. Now we are neck-and-neck for first place. Excited!

C'mon chaps, vote SME 20 for least musical.

barrymidd
20-10-10, 09:52 AM
If the vote was for the best engineered TT, the SME would probably win, but as it is for the LEAST musical, it should at least be near the top. This proves beyond doubt that design is more important than engineering quality when it comes to TTs. (There is a minimum level of engineering also required, but there is no direct correlation between engineering quality and sound quality.) Think Linn.

sq225917
20-10-10, 09:57 AM
I think `SME would be happy to know it comes in least musical... seeing as musical in this context is fruit box boom.

Blzebub
20-10-10, 10:02 AM
If the vote was for the best engineered TT, the SME would probably win, but as it is for the LEAST musical, it should at least be near the top. This proves beyond doubt that design is more important than engineering quality when it comes to TTs.

OK, so you've made a subjective statement: "..it [SME 20] is ... the LEAST musical.." and used that to "prove beyond doubt" some other vague statement about "design". How do you think you are doing, here? (Clue: not at all well).

Then you go on to cheer for Linn. I sold my Linn LP12 after comparing it with (among others) the SME 20. The SME reproduces music far more faithfully, IMO. Playing records is an engineering task. Sorry to disillusion any Linn romantics.

barrymidd
20-10-10, 10:04 AM
I think `SME would be happy to know it comes in least musical... seeing as musical in this context is fruit box boom.
To me the SME just sound a bit "dull" It could be that arm though. I am not a fan of SME arms, going right back to the 3009. Again, engineering excellence belies sound quality, I'm afraid.

Blzebub
20-10-10, 10:10 AM
Well, it sounds far from "dull" to me. Neutrality, contrary to popular belief, is anything but boring. Because of it's coloration, the LP12 effectively remasters every record you play. It also has a distinct lack of very low bass.

If the SME has an Achilles heel, it is in the supplied VdH arm cable.

matt j
20-10-10, 10:20 AM
To me the SME just sound a bit "dull" It could be that arm though. I am not a fan of SME arms, going right back to the 3009. Again, engineering excellence belies sound quality, I'm afraid.

You're getting confused between sounding nice and accuracy, if you like how a bouncy old fruit box sounds, that's great, but "better" it isn't. "Better" can only be measured by accuracy or something else tangible, not wishy-washy audiophool subjectivism.

Nobody says liking things that aren't accurate is a crime, but some people prefer things how they were recorded and not with a load of distortion thrown in to make it sound "nice".

barrymidd
20-10-10, 10:31 AM
FWIW I am no fan of Linn either, but merely used them to illustrate that an under-engineered deck (which Linns definitely are IMO) can still sound good.
It is no surprise that as you own an SME deck, you think they're the dog's knob. I don't so WOW, two people with different opinions on hifi kit. Who would have guessed that could happen?
I modify vintage Thorens decks and (unbelievably) I think they sound better than everything else. But believe me when I say that I have tested (subjectively) an awful lot of TTs over the years, So whilst you may not agree with it, my POV is as valid (if not more so) than anyone elses including yours.

Blzebub
20-10-10, 10:43 AM
FWIW I am no fan of Linn either, but merely used them to illustrate that an under-engineered deck (which Linns definitely are IMO) can still sound good.
It is no surprise that as you own an SME deck, you think they're the dog's knob. I don't so WOW, two people with different opinions on hifi kit. Who would have guessed that could happen?
I modify vintage Thorens decks and (unbelievably) I think they sound better than everything else. But believe me when I say that I have tested (subjectively) an awful lot of TTs over the years, So whilst you may not agree with it, my POV is as valid (if not more so) than anyone elses including yours.

Your POV is valid, but you used it to "prove beyond doubt" some other wishy-washy POV of yours about "design".

barrymidd
20-10-10, 10:48 AM
Nothing wishy washy about it. I'll put it another way, a well designed but under-engineered TT can sound better than a badly designed, but well engineered one. the reverse is not true.

jackal2513
20-10-10, 11:31 AM
Well, it sounds far from "dull" to me. Neutrality, contrary to popular belief, is anything but boring. Because of it's coloration, the LP12 effectively remasters every record you play. It also has a distinct lack of very low bass.

If the SME has an Achilles heel, it is in the supplied VdH arm cable.

have you tried banging a phantom on it yet ?

I absolutely love the SME 20 and 30. Never heard one but I love the looks, the idea, the quality and the whole ethos. Same goes for the V as well. I could get one just because its something I want in my living room.

That said, the "2 fingers up the establishment" sentiment behind the well tempered's bit of fisherman's thread, golf ball, walmart mains adapter and cup of melted silly putty has an equal amount of charm for me albeit from an almost diametrically opposed philosophical position. It completely laughs in the face of tens of thousands of pounds worth of motor supply, extruded subchassis and impossibly pernickerty "get out clause"* setup characteristics.



* i.e. if it sounds crap "Oh... it can't have been setup right"

sq225917
20-10-10, 11:39 AM
A cleverly designed TT fabricated by blind monekys will still sound shit, just like a TT designed by monkeys but made by Swiss Ateliers will. There is a sliding scale for both. Design competence and engineering precision that are fit for purpose go hand in hand.

The LP12 is a fruit box that introduces significant distortion into the playback compared to any SME deck. Just because some people like this doesn't make it a better deck by any measurable standard.

Popular and technically better are not often comfortable bed fellows. VHS/Betamax anyone?

Blzebub
20-10-10, 05:01 PM
have you tried banging a phantom on it yet ?



No. I've reached the point where everything is good enough.

jackal2513
20-10-10, 05:10 PM
No. I've reached the point where everything is good enough.

Cotton buds then :p

muzzer
20-10-10, 05:23 PM
Jackal are you married, do you have any real friends?

Blzebub
20-10-10, 06:21 PM
Cotton buds then :p

If that pleases you. I have had you pegged as a troll from the moment you first arrived.

Joe P
20-10-10, 06:39 PM
Bub,

Check the poll. My deck is less shit than yours.

Scientific fact. Look it up.

Joe

Steven Toy
20-10-10, 06:59 PM
If the SME has an Achilles heel, it is in the supplied VdH arm cable.

I thought cables made no difference ;)

If anything, in recent years I've learnt that musicality is essentially accuracy, timing acuity, detail retrieval and neutrality.

The Linn is coloured, euphonic and doesn't time properly.

jrmanders
20-10-10, 11:24 PM
The main problem why the SME 20 is always being described as un-musical is the SME V arm. I have recently bought the Firm Funk FXR II arm for my SME Model 20 and the result is much more music. The SME Model is just 'music' though, not musical. If you love music as opposed to hifi then the SME will get the job done better than most decks. The problem with other decks I have found is that you are aware of the system more than if the SME Model 20 is slotted into the system. I have also owned the Voyd and Michell Orbe and the SME wipes the floor with both musically.

Jonathan.

MVV
21-10-10, 02:15 AM
Negative, silly and stupid as both these threads are I have to say that it was the SME that made me challenge the 'LP12 is best' mindset I had been guarding for over 20 years. I heard Sweet Virginia from Exile and swear I could hear the room it was recorded in; a real evocation of Nelcott. I didn't buy one but it shifted my thinking. I didn't really audition it properly because I couldn't afford it.

Blzebub
21-10-10, 02:18 AM
Bub,

Check the poll. My deck is less shit than yours.

Scientific fact. Look it up.

Joe

Joe,

Correct. Teh interwebs poll proves that -- beyond any doubt.

Paul L
21-10-10, 02:20 AM
He's having a lie down. He's a bit depressed.Nah, he's part of the round-the-clock bedside vigil for Lady T, blending the soup, taking the crusts off the sandwiches etc.

Evil Emperor
21-10-10, 03:24 AM
Well, I think Po is the least sexy Teletubby, followed by Dipsy. Then La-La, but only because I've heard Tinky-Winky takes it up the zipper.

We should a poll about this, because it's about as relevant to hi-fi as this one.

jackal2513
21-10-10, 03:26 AM
I have had you pegged as a troll from the moment you first arrived.


It's reactive people like you though who have given the thread its 2,424 views and 7 pages. :(

Evil Emperor
21-10-10, 03:52 AM
It's reactive people like you though who have given the thread its 2,424 views and 7 pages. :(

So what? If you'd started a poll saying 'do mains cables make a difference?' we'd be up to 45 pages by now, with people still going round and round the same old running sore.

Life isn't a popularity contest... oh wait, it is.

Blzebub
21-10-10, 05:00 AM
It's reactive people like you though who have given the thread its 2,424 views and 7 pages. :(

People rubberneck at car crashes.

Unregistered
21-10-10, 12:36 PM
BMW drivers (tossers to a man) are the worst for that.

Hey, a poll...

Mike Reed
21-10-10, 12:48 PM
If that pleases you. I have had you pegged as a troll from the moment you first arrived.


A troll with a poll? Fol de rol ! A troll with a soul; : we're on a roll.:D

dss
21-10-10, 01:02 PM
Who would have figured that the generally accepting PFM community would be anti-smemites is it?

Why would the most expensive deck be the worst there. Surely the fans didn't buy it just to be unmusical, that seems strange.

DS

Basil
21-10-10, 01:03 PM
BMW drivers (tossers to a man) are the worst for that.

Hey, a poll...

Bollocks, bus drivers are far worse, bunch of c***ts!

jackal2513
21-10-10, 01:12 PM
The main problem why the SME 20 is always being described as un-musical is the SME V arm. I have recently bought the Firm Funk FXR II arm for my SME Model 20 and the result is much more music. The SME Model is just 'music' though, not musical. If you love music as opposed to hifi then the SME will get the job done better than most decks. The problem with other decks I have found is that you are aware of the system more than if the SME Model 20 is slotted into the system. I have also owned the Voyd and Michell Orbe and the SME wipes the floor with both musically.

Jonathan.

matey who i got my Miyabi from had them all, LP12, xerxes, Orbe, SME 10, 20 and then a 30

his friend had a 30 as well and they did a 30/V vs. 30/Phantom test with the same cart and the Graham was way betterr and more musical so that certainly bears out your findings as well

that said, he then went on to a Raven AC and ditched the 30 and reckoned it had the measure of the SME in every respect

jackal2513
21-10-10, 01:15 PM
People rubberneck at car crashes.

When I go past a crash I SPEED UP ... to make the point that the people around me slowing down are sub-human sensationalist self-centered selfish ignorant scum. Am I making myself clear enough here ... ?

jackal2513
21-10-10, 01:17 PM
So what?

So what ?


Don't project onto me man. Take responsibility for what you do. That's what.


Feel free to PM me if you don't fully understand. :)

Papa Lazarou
21-10-10, 02:51 PM
The main problem why the SME 20 is always being described as un-musical is the SME V arm. I have recently bought the Firm Funk FXR II arm for my SME Model 20 and the result is much more music. The SME Model is just 'music' though, not musical. If you love music as opposed to hifi then the SME will get the job done better than most decks. The problem with other decks I have found is that you are aware of the system more than if the SME Model 20 is slotted into the system. I have also owned the Voyd and Michell Orbe and the SME wipes the floor with both musically.

Jonathan.


Having heard the SME 20/2a many times I can appreciate the great engineering and build. I cannot say it plays a tune like a 3 motor Voyd though - belt drive done properly IMO.

jackal2513
21-10-10, 02:56 PM
Having heard the SME 20/2a many times I can appreciate the great engineering and build. I cannot say it plays a tune like a 3 motor Voyd though - belt drive done properly IMO.

What are and cart did you hear it with ?

Batty
21-10-10, 03:23 PM
I can't vote as I've only heard the Rock and am therefore excluded by lack of knowledge on the subject, but would like to see the result of the poll.

Interesting results.

dss
21-10-10, 03:37 PM
I didn't like the Clearaudio record cleaning machine, I felt it made the records too clean and clinical sounding is it.

DS

Papa Lazarou
21-10-10, 03:44 PM
What are and cart did you hear it with ?

Kondo-wired SME V and IO-M.

jackal2513
21-10-10, 04:31 PM
Kondo-wired SME V and IO-M.

There you go then :confused:

Did you read jrmanders' post ? And mine regarding the 30+Phantom arm ?

IWC Doppel
22-10-10, 06:42 AM
Negative, silly and stupid as both these threads are I have to say that it was the SME that made me challenge the 'LP12 is best' mindset I had been guarding for over 20 years. I heard Sweet Virginia from Exile and swear I could hear the room it was recorded in; a real evocation of Nelcott. I didn't buy one but it shifted my thinking. I didn't really audition it properly because I couldn't afford it.

Blimey I have heard the 20 and 30 on numerous occasions and always walked dissapointed.

jaz9706
22-10-10, 07:17 AM
what is it with people? one valid question degenerates into mud slinging on an epic scale! I HATE lp12's but cant deny that they are musical , but at the same time think that there is far more to life than posting insults at eveyone who thinks different to me as I seem to remember that my father fought against people like that in 1940!

MVV
22-10-10, 09:46 AM
Mr Doppel, I don't know what model it was but it also had a pretty impressive looking sme tonearm.

dss
22-10-10, 09:59 AM
what is it with people? one valid question degenerates into mud slinging on an epic scale! I HATE lp12's but cant deny that they are musical , but at the same time think that there is far more to life than posting insults at eveyone who thinks different to me as I seem to remember that my father fought against people like that in 1940!

Which side was he on is it?

DS

Blzebub
22-10-10, 10:43 AM
The SME 20 is still winning.

Covkxw
22-10-10, 11:14 AM
The SME 20 is still winning.

Seems the (hifi) peasants are still revolting: let them eat cake ;)

jackal2513
22-10-10, 11:43 AM
very soon all tables will be level at around 35 points apiece

its at this time we should lock the thread and I will announce the winner

Blzebub
22-10-10, 02:32 PM
The SME will win, because it's the best one.

chainrule
22-10-10, 03:58 PM
i voted for the sme, because i have one and love it. i had an LP12 for over 20 years, and i find my self listening to the 20 so much more, not that i didn't listen to the LP12 frequently and enjoy listening to it greatly.

so, if going from the LP12 to SME 20, and upping the hours i listen is moving from musical to unmusical, i want the most unmusical deck possible.

sq225917
22-10-10, 05:16 PM
like wise I went from LP12 to SME 10 a huge step upwards.

i_should_coco
23-10-10, 05:39 AM
Least coloured one-note-bass TT? Yep, defo the SME.

Covkxw
23-10-10, 05:59 AM
Least coloured one-note-bass TT? Yep, defo the SME.

That's because the SME goes real low, low, LOW. Down to 5Hz, don't cha know :p

dss
02-11-10, 06:42 AM
So, are the final results in yet is it?

DS

PsB
02-11-10, 01:34 PM
I didn't vote in this poll as I don't know half the turntables in the list. I'm sure most of the turntables listed here sound anything from good to excellent, and there will be bigger variations between different pressings of the same LP as illustrated by Tony here some time ago.

My unmusical SME sounds effortless, dynamic and natural to me. I also like my old Rega at a different price point, for different reasons.

Dik Dolan
02-11-10, 02:36 PM
I voted SME too. As PsB says, my SME is also so unmusical it just gets out of the way and lets me hear more of what's on my records.

Joe Hutch
02-11-10, 02:39 PM
I voted for the Rega because it was the underdog.

Dik Dolan
02-11-10, 03:22 PM
But now the lovely Xerxes is in "last" place. I'm sure with enough vote rigging we can get 'em all level pegging, and "prove" that they all sound unmusical.

Joe P
02-11-10, 03:30 PM
Yea, the P9 is still the second least sucky deck!

Joe

Still
02-11-10, 06:08 PM
That's my TT dilemma solved - Xerxes 20 it is. Does anyone know if they sound any good?