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  #31  
Old 25-04-12, 05:02 AM
bdw bdw is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 4
i get depressed with this sort of thing. the internet seems to be full of people that want to con you. i remember looking around alibaba and thinking of setting up a business reselling in Europe things that you can get for a decent price in the far east, but i heard too many horror stories to think about it seriously.

and is the same buying and selling cars now.

i hate that you cant trust people any more, and i also hate that ebay are not holding up their end of the bargain, but they are so powerful now the barriers to entering the market are too big.
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  #32  
Old 25-04-12, 07:04 AM
RobH RobH is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 45
I've had the same problems recently too, a couple of non-payments with no communication and one who refused to pay the carriage charge for an item to China. My original listing was UK only. You have no choice but to accept the winning bid no matter what, and I had quoted only the basic carriage charge straight from the couriers website. Very frustrating. After the usual long wait I did get my ebay fees back each time though. This hardly ever used to happen though, what's changed?
Also very annoying that you can't leave negative feedback in that case, there is no sense to that at all!
And the fees are excessive!
Rant over. I feel better now.
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  #33  
Old 31-05-12, 08:42 AM
Doomlord_uk Doomlord_uk is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 108
I'm not a trader who runs a business on eBay - yet - but I have used eBay since they first set up here in the Uk, and Yahoo auctions before that. So I have a fair bit of experience.

There are a few things to consider.

eBay provides a fairly unique service - it's a huge marketplace and has global reach, so it puts you in contact with potential buyers in a LOT of places. That in turn can increase your potential sale price (for an auction, anyway). This, to me, is its advantage as a selling medium.

eBay is NOT the company it used to be, and will never go back to being that. Auctions are an ever-shrinking part of its business, and private sellers are an ever shrinking part of its business. eBay absolutely wants to be the next Amazon - a universal online shopping portal. The point was made that eBay is effectively a monopoly and that is correct too. It has no competition and thus no incentive to compete for customers.

eBay doesn't do much if anything about dodgy bidders, scammers etc because IT MAKES MONEY FROM THEM! Every scam bid that gets cancelled, they make a listing fee on that regardless. Getting that refunded is a royal PITA.

eBay doesn't allow NF for buyers because it depends on buyers to attract the sellers who pay the fees... NF drives buyers away. The only you can do and MUST do is file a complaint for non-payment. Eventually after three strikes they get whack-a-moled and have to create a new account. It's not much.

If you are serious about being paid then it is basically up to you to take action directly. eBay can be sued but so too can the buyer (unless I'm mistaken) - a bid is a legally binding contract I believe. Suing 'customers' sounds bad for business but non-payers are NOT customers. But if you don't take action... they get away with it. And the fact is, I've never even heard of a bidder being sued for non-payment. The more people get away with behavng badly, the worse it gets. The fact is, we are all responsible in part for creating this situation.

As for blatantly fraudulant trades etc... go to the police, go to your solicitors. If the police say 'not interested' file a complaint! This is, of course, one of the fundamental reasons the UK sucks so much - because we (including as traders) are notorious for not complaining. The result is that corporations dump on us, rip us off, treat us badly - and get away with it. I'm sorry - but we ALL have to fight, all the time. that is the nature of life.

Another point - we are in a recession. There are more and more people getting more and more desperate and if hitting BiN to remove a competing auction for a few days helps, it will happen. Or hitting BiN and then trying to negotiate a lower price after the fact... etc. Get smart, and at the least make it clear in your sale conditions that the accepted bid price is FINAL.

Certainly block bids from people with no registered credit card and insist on immediate payment (doesn't work for items over 1000 though I believe). Forget 'PP for deposit, cheque for balance' as that plainly falls under their 'fee avoidance' rules and always has done. It's a loada crap, but can't be helped.

Yes, eBay/Paypal is expensive but if you seek out the advantages - market reach, basically - and avoid the obvious mistakes then you can still enjoy it. It's not for every commodity or item type. ANd of course as eBay gets worse, more sellers - and thus more buyers - go elsewhere. Amazon, for one, and also forums.

Forums, of course, carry their own risks... but generally seem to take trading standards more seriously.

Anyway, if you don't like eBay, don't use it. But if you make that decision, make sure that when you close your account with them, that you tell them why. No feedback means no chance of change. Do your part - complain!!!
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  #34  
Old 31-05-12, 08:47 AM
Doomlord_uk Doomlord_uk is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 108
One more thought... BiN is a tempting sale option, but it carries one problem - you can't cancel a BiN bid. If you have a lot of issues with bad BiN bidding, you could simply try going with an auction format with the start price set at the min price you want. You may have to wait longer for the auction to close it might seem, but if the current top bidder agrees - you CAN close early with the top bid becoming the winning (and binding) bid. Now you have a chance to verify your bidder before closing like that... you also save on BiN fees. Perhaps worth considering.
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  #35  
Old 31-05-12, 08:52 AM
Doomlord_uk Doomlord_uk is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 108
One last thing, that I wanted to put in a post by itself.

Organise!

If ALL reputable, serious hifi dealers - say, all BADA members - jointly negotiated with eBay and acted *together* you might have a chance to make a difference. You guys generate a lot of revenue for eBay directly, so together your voice might make a difference.

And imagine if you pulled out - collectively - from the eBay marketplace. Not only do they lose revenue, they lose buyers who then would not go looking AND they are left with only private and dodgy independent sellers only, which then reduces the appeal of eBay - it goes back to being 'fleabay' which is what it is absolutely trying to get away from.

You have power - use it.
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  #36  
Old 31-05-12, 11:09 AM
k4pog k4pog is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 651
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doomlord_uk View Post
I'm not a trader who runs a business on eBay - yet - but I have used eBay since they first set up here in the Uk, and Yahoo auctions before that. So I have a fair bit of experience.

There are a few things to consider.

eBay provides a fairly unique service - it's a huge marketplace and has global reach, so it puts you in contact with potential buyers in a LOT of places. That in turn can increase your potential sale price (for an auction, anyway). This, to me, is its advantage as a selling medium.

eBay is NOT the company it used to be, and will never go back to being that. Auctions are an ever-shrinking part of its business, and private sellers are an ever shrinking part of its business. eBay absolutely wants to be the next Amazon - a universal online shopping portal. The point was made that eBay is effectively a monopoly and that is correct too. It has no competition and thus no incentive to compete for customers.

eBay doesn't do much if anything about dodgy bidders, scammers etc because IT MAKES MONEY FROM THEM! Every scam bid that gets cancelled, they make a listing fee on that regardless. Getting that refunded is a royal PITA.

eBay doesn't allow NF for buyers because it depends on buyers to attract the sellers who pay the fees... NF drives buyers away. The only you can do and MUST do is file a complaint for non-payment. Eventually after three strikes they get whack-a-moled and have to create a new account. It's not much.

If you are serious about being paid then it is basically up to you to take action directly. eBay can be sued but so too can the buyer (unless I'm mistaken) - a bid is a legally binding contract I believe. Suing 'customers' sounds bad for business but non-payers are NOT customers. But if you don't take action... they get away with it. And the fact is, I've never even heard of a bidder being sued for non-payment. The more people get away with behavng badly, the worse it gets. The fact is, we are all responsible in part for creating this situation.

As for blatantly fraudulant trades etc... go to the police, go to your solicitors. If the police say 'not interested' file a complaint! This is, of course, one of the fundamental reasons the UK sucks so much - because we (including as traders) are notorious for not complaining. The result is that corporations dump on us, rip us off, treat us badly - and get away with it. I'm sorry - but we ALL have to fight, all the time. that is the nature of life.

Another point - we are in a recession. There are more and more people getting more and more desperate and if hitting BiN to remove a competing auction for a few days helps, it will happen. Or hitting BiN and then trying to negotiate a lower price after the fact... etc. Get smart, and at the least make it clear in your sale conditions that the accepted bid price is FINAL.

Certainly block bids from people with no registered credit card and insist on immediate payment (doesn't work for items over 1000 though I believe). Forget 'PP for deposit, cheque for balance' as that plainly falls under their 'fee avoidance' rules and always has done. It's a loada crap, but can't be helped.

Yes, eBay/Paypal is expensive but if you seek out the advantages - market reach, basically - and avoid the obvious mistakes then you can still enjoy it. It's not for every commodity or item type. ANd of course as eBay gets worse, more sellers - and thus more buyers - go elsewhere. Amazon, for one, and also forums.

Forums, of course, carry their own risks... but generally seem to take trading standards more seriously.

Anyway, if you don't like eBay, don't use it. But if you make that decision, make sure that when you close your account with them, that you tell them why. No feedback means no chance of change. Do your part - complain!!!
My biggest gripe with them at the moment is the huge recent jump in "dealers" fees
Obviously,dealers provide ebay with their biggest income,so you could say we are their "best customers"
In most other businesses,the "best customers" are normally offered incentives and generally well looked after,but with ebay,it's the total opposite

For example,a private seller recently sold 3 high value audio items for a total of circa 26000
His final value fees would have been around 120 in total,which is truly exceptional value

If myself or any other registered dealer had sold the same,our FVF would have been around 1100 ! (even allowing for my 15% discount on fees,recently dropped from 25%)
Oh and not forgetting the paypal fees on top of course !

I'm not saying private sellers should be charged considerably more,but the gulf in fees between "private" and "trade" sellers is ridiculous

In the long term,ebay will be worse off,as more and more dealers will use them purely to advertise their items,then do their utmost to sell outside of ebay,hence they will lose the FVF fees in the process
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  #37  
Old 31-05-12, 12:08 PM
hifinutt hifinutt is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,049
not sure i get this figure, i sold items worth 700 on ebay and was charged around 70 quid seller fees
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  #38  
Old 31-05-12, 12:33 PM
daws0n daws0n is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 503
Agreed, his fees should of been much higher - nearly a grand by my estimation. It was my understanding that business/dealers enjoy low % rates on final value/paypal fees?
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  #39  
Old 31-05-12, 11:10 PM
CJ1045 CJ1045 is offline
You want Briks with that?
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 2,089
The final value fee for a private seller is 10% but capped at 40 per item. Business sellers in the new 'Sound and Vision' section have a 5% final value fee but no cap. As John (K4POG) mentions there used to be a discount for Top Rated seller but that has just been cut.

http://pages.ebay.co.uk/help/sell/fees.html

John's figures are right.

CJ
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  #40  
Old 01-06-12, 12:37 AM
daws0n daws0n is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 503
Jeez - that's insane! Good news for private sellers I suppose, but what a blow to traders.
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  #41  
Old 01-06-12, 02:26 AM
CJ1045 CJ1045 is offline
You want Briks with that?
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 2,089
For traders it used to be 3% with no cap, as of this month it is now 5% with no cap.

CJ
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  #42  
Old 02-06-12, 11:48 AM
AV8 AV8 is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by CJ1045 View Post
For traders it used to be 3% with no cap, as of this month it is now 5% with no cap.

CJ
Interesting , a dealer who wanted to take my goods as trade in was quoting Ebay sales at the lowest end less 10% sellers fees , greedy sod was profiteering by 7% straightaway then on the old rate .
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  #43  
Old 05-06-12, 11:01 AM
sq225917 sq225917 is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 17,247
Sold a scope today, guy in France bought it, I didn't intend to offer international postage, he wouldn't agree to cancel, the prick, cost me #25.
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  #44  
Old 05-06-12, 11:09 AM
daws0n daws0n is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 503
I had a similar issue when I sold a power supply on there recently... Specifically stated NO INTERNATIONAL POSTAGE and he bought it anyway!

He declined my request to cancel and lumped me with 40 seller fees... Eventually I sent it and it worked out in the end, but it's ridiculous eBay don't step in with these kinds of incidents after taking your money.
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  #45  
Old 08-06-12, 04:03 AM
divedeepdog divedeepdog is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,232
Just read an announcement lifting the final valuation fees to 75, from 40.

Get those valuables listed quickly .
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