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  #31  
Old 06-02-17, 02:10 PM
Ragaman Ragaman is offline
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Have you given Rega a try, has plenty of soul.
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  #32  
Old 06-02-17, 02:40 PM
adamk adamk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragaman View Post
Have you given Rega a try, has plenty of soul.
Good shout.
I had a listen to an Osiris - very good but not up to 252/300 level to my ears.
We all hear it different - use the search facility and theres someone replacing a 552 fronted system with an Osiris.
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  #33  
Old 06-02-17, 03:21 PM
beammeup beammeup is offline
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I'm doing the opposite by moving to naim for the first ever time, buying an 80's NAC 42 / NAP 140
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  #34  
Old 06-02-17, 03:50 PM
ryder ryder is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Octave Doctor View Post
Hi all,

I'm probably selling my Naim gear soon, I have 252/Supercap(DR), 300, CDS3, 555PS (DR) and I want to try something new (I've had Naim for about 25 years now and I feel that it's time for a change). I've heard the Devialet 220 Pro Expert recently (although only briefly) and also a Vitus integrated amp (the RI-100) and both units were really good although I thought the Devialet was slightly cold sounding...it was engaging but lacked a bit of soul. The Vitus was really good but I would need to add a DAC to it (eventually) so that makes it quite pricey. In addition different speakers cables and interconnects will be required so that adds to the cost...having said that I will obviously sell my Naim I/C's, speaker cables etc.

Has anyone experienced either of the amps mentioned and if so any thoughts on them? It would be interesting to hear from ex Naim users who have taken the plunge and jumped ship.

Many thanks

PS At a later stage I will be looking to buy a streamer/server (or just a server)...has anyone heard the Innous Zenith MK.11?
I haven't read all responses here. You may consider getting a non-Naim integrated if you want to have a different listening experience. In that way you don't need to sell your Naim gear. It wouldn't be too much of a hassle to switch between amplifiers if it's a one-box integrated. Another alternative is a different bookshelf speaker where you can always swap in and out whenever you crave for a different sound.
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  #35  
Old 06-02-17, 10:08 PM
jy3 jy3 is offline
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I was a Naim user for 20 years, ending with 52/supercap/135's into Obelisks but have now moved on to NVA amps with their Cube speakers. I can only say the music just flows and and cannot see me ever changing. If you must spend mega bucks, Vitus and VTL would be my recommendations for amps, but why?
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  #36  
Old 06-02-17, 10:27 PM
ryder ryder is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jy3 View Post
I was a Naim user for 20 years, ending with 52/supercap/135's into Obelisks but have now moved on to NVA amps with their Cube speakers. I can only say the music just flows and and cannot see me ever changing. If you must spend mega bucks, Vitus and VTL would be my recommendations for amps, but why?
Which NVA amp do you own? I have owned the NVA AP70 integrated for a very brief period and it was very nice. It was better than my separates costing three times more as it better matched my Harbeth speakers at that time. And the interesting part is the Nait XS replaced the NVA AP70 in the same system.

The choice is very much dependent on system matching and musical preference. I note that the Naims and NVA amps were used on different speakers in your system which had evolved through time.
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  #37  
Old 06-02-17, 10:44 PM
ryder ryder is offline
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Time really flies. I have been using Naim for 9 years now and it didn't feel like I have had them for that long. Most amps usuallly do not last more than 5 years in my system. I can still recall the day I got the Harbeth SHL5s (about 8 years ago) as I did some crazy amp swapping at that time to make the speakers work. I tried not less than half a dozen amps with the Harbeth in the first two years and that was when I discovered Naim. From Nait XS to the NAC 202 / NAP 200 and now the NAC 282, Hicap DR and NAP 250 DR driving the latest Harbeth SHL5 Plus. I suspect this system may very well outlive me. I still have the NAC 202 and NAP 200 in a second system. Somehow I cannot seem to let them go, not just yet.
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  #38  
Old 06-02-17, 11:13 PM
jy3 jy3 is offline
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I am using NVA P50 pre and A60 power amp into Cube 3's. I never tried these amps into the Obelisks or the Naim amps into the Cubes. With the NVA system I just listen to the music and can do so for longer, with the Naim system although enjoyable I now realise it was a short term hit.
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  #39  
Old 06-02-17, 11:46 PM
Bas V Bas V is offline
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My two cents would be the JOB PRE2 & 225 or maybe even the Integrated. These amps are amazing, regardless their (low) price.
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  #40  
Old 07-02-17, 03:08 AM
Konteebos Konteebos is offline
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Just to provide some balance on the NVA vs NAIM posts - I replaced my NVA P50sa pre and A60 combination with a NAIM SuperNAIT and found it to be better in every way. That was driving Linn Ninkas so maybe they weren't a great match for the NVA...
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  #41  
Old 07-02-17, 03:55 AM
Colonel_Mad Colonel_Mad is offline
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In my opinion the trend for "moving on from Naim" is based on the fortunes of the company in the years since Julian Vereker died. He was really a unique guy. One of the old school hifi company designer/owners who lived their hobby, no doubt, but perhaps the only one who really latched onto the burgeoning internet age as he did.

Naim looked good, sounded good and it was easy to follow its upgrade paths. It was priced at a level you really had to save up for (building desirability and anticipation) and then after all that there was the designer of the gear who was accessible night and day on the internet to discuss your system, musical interests and the future direction of the companies products. He provided a fascinating insight. He 'gave' as much as he took from his customers, always keen to explain the thought processes behind new products and welcomed you into feeling part of the company yourself, even as a lowly customer. A great bit of marketing and I suspect it was all a bit unintentional. If you were outside that part of the culture you perhaps didn't understand why people were so brand loyal when the products themselves, whilst up there with the best, could arguably be bettered in hifi terms.

There was cheaper gear, better gear, more functional gear out there but the whole set up drew the customers in to something more. Since Julian's death that key part has been sucked out of the company slowly, year by year. It is only now that aspect of the Naim brand has completely gone that people are realising that, yes, there are other hifis out there that competed/out-competed Naim at the time and also that their second hand values are far more within reach all these years on. People are increasingly open to giving them a try.

I guess my conclusion is that Naim isn't suddenly bad hifi. Just that the brand loyalty has been eroded as the support and culture that once surrounded the brand has diminished. People no longer associate ownership with being part of a wider movement or members club and instead are (probably quite rightly) putting more emphasis on performance and value for money.

I still won't be selling mine for now as I love what I have, but I don't think I'd hesitate to move on from Naim myself anymore if the upgrade bug ever hits.
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  #42  
Old 07-02-17, 06:38 AM
Octave Doctor Octave Doctor is offline
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Hi again,

A big thanks for everyone's input and advice...I've lined up a couple of dems so I will post an update within a week or so once I've listened to a few systems.

Regards
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  #43  
Old 07-02-17, 06:48 AM
Octave Doctor Octave Doctor is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adamk View Post
I was in a similar position this time last year, 20 years of Naim ownership- CDS3, 252, 300.
During the golden age of the WigWam I heard many fine systems, but none that ever made me question my continued Naim ownership, but there was always that nagging doubt that there must be something else.

Fast forward to now and the Naim is gone and replaced by a Devialet Expert 400. I was not bowled over by a 200 (previous version to the 220 you have heard), the magic only happened by doubling them up into mono block version. I think there is plenty of similarity between the Devialet and Naim house sound - YMMV.
My advice would therefore be to hear a 440 set up.
I'm going to listen to the 220 Pro Expert and if I like it I can then (in the future) upgrade to the 440.
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  #44  
Old 07-02-17, 07:03 AM
Octave Doctor Octave Doctor is offline
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Posts: 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by Colonel_Mad View Post
In my opinion the trend for "moving on from Naim" is based on the fortunes of the company in the years since Julian Vereker died. He was really a unique guy. One of the old school hifi company designer/owners who lived their hobby, no doubt, but perhaps the only one who really latched onto the burgeoning internet age as he did.

Naim looked good, sounded good and it was easy to follow its upgrade paths. It was priced at a level you really had to save up for (building desirability and anticipation) and then after all that there was the designer of the gear who was accessible night and day on the internet to discuss your system, musical interests and the future direction of the companies products. He provided a fascinating insight. He 'gave' as much as he took from his customers, always keen to explain the thought processes behind new products and welcomed you into feeling part of the company yourself, even as a lowly customer. A great bit of marketing and I suspect it was all a bit unintentional. If you were outside that part of the culture you perhaps didn't understand why people were so brand loyal when the products themselves, whilst up there with the best, could arguably be bettered in hifi terms.

There was cheaper gear, better gear, more functional gear out there but the whole set up drew the customers in to something more. Since Julian's death that key part has been sucked out of the company slowly, year by year. It is only now that aspect of the Naim brand has completely gone that people are realising that, yes, there are other hifis out there that competed/out-competed Naim at the time and also that their second hand values are far more within reach all these years on. People are increasingly open to giving them a try.

I guess my conclusion is that Naim isn't suddenly bad hifi. Just that the brand loyalty has been eroded as the support and culture that once surrounded the brand has diminished. People no longer associate ownership with being part of a wider movement or members club and instead are (probably quite rightly) putting more emphasis on performance and value for money.

I still won't be selling mine for now as I love what I have, but I don't think I'd hesitate to move on from Naim myself anymore if the upgrade bug ever hits.
I agree....I think value for money is utmost in most buyers minds these days. TBH I'm getting frustrated with Naim...the cost of upgrading (to DR) is too much I believe and I can't justify the cost of another DR upgrade (I had my 555PS upgraded to DR last year). I would also like to replace my NAC5 speaker cable (I've heard the Super Lumina speaker cable) but that's more expense so I figured let's just change the system.
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  #45  
Old 07-02-17, 07:26 AM
Mike Reed Mike Reed is offline
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About the only Naim thing I have left, apart from my 01, is the NAC A5; and it's staying ! Very versatile cable to happily go from moving coil to electrostatic speakers and from s/s to valved power.
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