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Biden for president

Discussion in 'off topic' started by thebiglebowski, Nov 10, 2017.

  1. thebiglebowski

    thebiglebowski pfm Member

  2. windhoek

    windhoek pfm Member

    Always? Sometimes something else???

     
  3. vuk

    vuk \o/ choose anarchy

    why would the party want a goofball like biden when they have the most popular politician in the country right now?


    vuk.
     
  4. droodzilla

    droodzilla pfm Member

    Sounds like a bad idea. Surely he's too tainted by association with the Democrat establishment to win back disaffected white working class voters.

    It would be better to give Sanders a try. Or a younger Democrat from the left of the party.
     
  5. vuk

    vuk \o/ choose anarchy

    drood.

    i agree. would be nice to see somebody young, maybe even as VP. anyone in mind?

    btw -- tony does not allow hot chick avatars.


    vuk.
     
  6. rbrown

    rbrown I think therefore I think I am

    Agreed. Sanders would probably be president right now if he hadn’t been stitched up by the democrats. He had a lot of popular support in the dirt poor Trump voting areas.
     
  7. droodzilla

    droodzilla pfm Member

    I'm sure he'll make an exception for Buffy.

    I don't know the Democrats well enough to offer an informed opinion but Tulsi Gabbard has talked a lot of sense in some of the interviews I've seen. No idea if she has the support within the party though.
     
  8. Paul R

    Paul R pfm Member

    Biden is old, really old. Risen from the dead old. He got knocked out decades ago over some plagiarism of Neil Kinnock. That old.

    Sanders is old but fresh. There must be an alternative. At the moment two term Trump isn't implausible.

    Paul
     
  9. sean99

    sean99 pfm Member

    Maybe, but Sanders would have had a much harder time in the general election once they hung socialism and government takeover of healthcare around his neck.

    I think some of you non-Americans don't understand just how much of a political poison the word socialism is in the US. Much of the US is still at the McCarthyite "reds under the bed" level of political discourse. If someone is a socialist then they're pure evil and you must disregard anything that comes out of their mouths.

    Sanders would have had a much, much tougher time in the general election than he did in the Democratic primaries.
     
    Yank, PsB and gassor like this.
  10. rbrown

    rbrown I think therefore I think I am

    I’m not so sure, he had a lot more popular support than Hillary and she won numerically. He did amazingly well with no corporate backing, especially as money has always been the best predictor of who will win.
     
  11. droodzilla

    droodzilla pfm Member

  12. wacko

    wacko pfm Member

    I suppose it would be too much to expect most American voters to know that there are no 'reds' and that Russia is as capitalist as the USA. Whereas a little socialism is necessary for a civilised society.
     
  13. tones

    tones Tones deaf

    The problem with Bernie is the US aversion to the word "socialist" - I remember when Obama was elected, some of my US colleagues said, "...but he's a - socialist", the last word said in the slightly horrified tone that they'd have used if he was a known carrier of bubonic plague (I guess they rate the same on the US horror scale). Had Bernie won the nomination, the Republicans would have mercilessly hung this around his neck, trumpeted (Trumpeted?) it endlessly in a we-beat-the evil-empire-in-1990-and-here-it-is-again manner, and the result would have been (I believe) not merely a victory for Donald, but a landslide.
     
    vuk likes this.
  14. Sue Pertwee-Tyr

    Sue Pertwee-Tyr pfm Member

    Is socialist the new black?
     
  15. PsB

    PsB Citizen of Nowhere™

    Not only that, but they would have pulled out all the old dirt from his days as a young radical, and then probably made some up. You can bet there would have been a drug scandal or two, allegations of wild orgies, etc. The Repubs were objective allies of Sanders right from the start.

    Anyway, the key for the Dems right now, rather than agonizing about the last election, must be to focus on the 2018 mid-terms. The recent elections were encouraging. Only by increasing representation at the local and state level will they be able to start reversing the toxic effects of decades of GOP gerrymandering, voter suppression schemes, etc.
     
  16. vuk

    vuk \o/ choose anarchy

    tones & PsB,

    thanks for the insight into your world of the 1%, but socialism doesn't seem to be perceived in that way in these new, post-industrial times by the majority of people. you can speculate all you want on an alternate reality of bernie sanders perceptions, but the current facts are that he is the most popular politician in america. it's just as likely that trying to smear him would backfire on those less popular who tried to do it.


    vuk.
     
  17. Sue Pertwee-Tyr

    Sue Pertwee-Tyr pfm Member

    One further problem with the current campaigning methodologies is that you either end up with Senator Bland from Safesville, or somebody like Teflon Tone, or Trump, who are so slippery the mud just slides off.
     
  18. tones

    tones Tones deaf

    Are you really so sure of that, Vuk? It seems to me that it has acquired a bad name and it will retain that bad name regardless of any logic or post-industrialisation. Conservative Americans of my acquaintance appear totally incapable of regarding socialism as just another type of political system, but rather as a threat to the existence of an American Utopia, the cornucopia of all goodies. Bernie may indeed be popular, but I think the "socialism" tag would crucify him in the eyes of a majority of US voters, even progressive ones.
     
  19. Sue Pertwee-Tyr

    Sue Pertwee-Tyr pfm Member

    Surely it isn't impossible to rebrand socialism with a new name?
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2017
  20. Hook

    Hook pfm Member

    Social security. Social welfare. Social, dare I say, healthcare? All are popular concepts that could be re-branded in a new area of left-leaning, worker-friendly (and not to be confused with Trump’s brand of) populism.

    It’s that -ist thing that gives most Americans the chills, at least those who are old enough to remember the USSR.
     

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