1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Where we are now: The site is back up and running! The character set encoding issue has been fixed so old posts should now look ok. I am currently working on themes/skins etc and I will be deleting the temporary green skin very soon as it has many issues. I will do a very quick variation on the stock blue skin first just to get a light-grey background and san-serif font, and I will set this as default. Later this week I will hopefully add a professional third-party skin in pfm colours (life is way too short to do this crap myself, and I've found one I really like than needs next to no tweaking). We are getting there slowly...
    Dismiss Notice
  3. May I please request people check and update their email address if it is out if date. I ask as I’m getting countless bounce errors as the server fails to send notifications through etc. I’ll eventually figure out how to send these to a black hole somewhere, but it makes sense to address it at source as quite a few folk are obviously not getting the thread and conversations notifications they have set in their preferences.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. Things you need to know about the new ‘Conversations’ PM system:

    a) DO NOT REPLY TO THE NOTIFICATION EMAIL! I get them, not the intended recipient. I get a lot of them and I do not want them! It is just a notification, log into the site and reply from there.

    b) To delete old conversations use the ‘Leave conversation’ option. This is just delete by another name.
    Dismiss Notice

Ebay seller sent wrong record in inadequate packing

Discussion in 'off topic' started by Mike Reed, Nov 10, 2017.

  1. Mike Reed

    Mike Reed pfm Member

    Strange one; I was looking forward to receiving a nm record on Thursday, but the lady had sent the wrong one. She'd used an old Amazon record mailer without stiffeners and as a consequence the (mint) record cover was creased across one corner. I took pic's of the unopened package plus the record crease

    I suggested either a contribution to cover extra postage and take a punt on the record (although I hadn't liked the CD of it previously) or to return the record to her in my own mailer or reinforced old one in return for the postage cost.

    She now asks me to send the record back and will refund on receipt AND send the record I had bought. I'm not happy with this arrangement and the extended wait for my record. She has about 180 100% feedback.

    My inclination is that it's her fault, my hassle and I've made an attempt to sort it out, but hadn't expected to make the first move, as it were. I don't want to make a big issue with this, incl. contacting Ebay/Paypal, but feel she should honour her obligations first.

    You'll have a lot more experience with Ebay situations than me, and I wonder what you'd advise, as it's got me a bit stumped.
     
  2. JensenHealey

    JensenHealey pfm Member

    If you put yourself in her position - you would want the stuff sent back first. Her suggestion seems reasonable to me. Could be just one of those things,

    I don't think she would be expected to send out another parcel before you send the wrong 'un back.
     
  3. Cav

    Cav pfm Member

    I'm not sure I understand. She sent the wrong item and it arrived damaged? So why not send it back and get the one you did want? Presumably she will refund the return postage?
     
  4. richgilb

    richgilb pfm Member

    I tend to send the right one when I make that mistake and hope that the buyer will send it back afterwards.

    I suspect a nice email to her will result in her sending it on first. Expect her to block you from buying from her again if you leave neutral or negative feedback. I always do. Having said that there are only about 5 people in my blocked list and I sell maybe 100 items a week on ebay.
     
  5. blossomchris

    blossomchris pfm Member

    Mike, am I correct in thinking, correct sleeve, incorrect record within?
    If the above is the case and the sleeve is not an issue, go for a swap of records, if not return for a refund as incorrectly supplied.
    In cases where I have returned an item, after contacting Ebay, I have received full reimbursement for all p&p incurred.

    Bloss
     
  6. Mike Reed

    Mike Reed pfm Member

    Thank you, gentlemen. Bloss, the complete wrong record was sent; although the covers have a similar appearance but entirely different colours and slightly different title, she really didn't check it properly before despatch, compounded by the fact that it shouldn't have been sent in that obviously inadequate packaging. Her postage etc. was good, and my emails have been understanding and polite, which has been acknowledged.

    I did offer a contribution (to cover extra postage) to keep the record, though I don't particularly want it. She offered me a deal for the same amount + postage again as I paid (by making an offer), but I didn't know until last evening's email that she was asking twice the price for the one sent. Despite the crease on cover, a reasonable deal except that it's not what I want, having heard the CD some months ago.

    Richard, your comment on how you'd deal with this is how I feel that it should be done. I'll play the record later today and see if it'll grow on me; the CD certainly wouldn't. I really think she should have (as Richard would do) despatched the correct record a.s.a.p. after I emailed her on Thursday and then negotiated the return or whatever. Her valuation of the record would have decreased (!) as well, I suppose.
     
  7. doctorf

    doctorf left footed right winger

    Why not just use the eBay resolution system?
     
  8. richgilb

    richgilb pfm Member

    It's a tough one because I do lose a bit of stock from people that can't be bothered to send the wrong one back. But it is about 1 a year, so I just send the right one and hope they send it back.

    I used to even prepay a RM label to encourage the return.But when they don't send it and the label expires, it just goes from bad to worse. So I know where she is coming from. The faceless side of ebay encourages mistrust on both sides. The phone helps.

    As an ebay trader myself, going through ebay procedures to resolve stuff and also leaving bad feedback is a bit of a ballache for both sides and creates bad feeling in my case. I do harbour some resentment for people that do it. What people don't remember often is that we probably have your phone number from the transaction and we always email, email again, telephone you to try to talk to you about the problem. And then we block buyers from buying again if they leave bad feedback but don't reply to our messages or pick up the phone. When they do pick up, people often feel a bit awkward about the feedback and agree to change it, which is another ballache for everyone.

    I really think getting a big coroporation to intervene on a small issue is unhelpful in most cases. After all, they just want our money, not justice. We ask for their help after the buyer leaves bad feedback and will not remove it. Most of the negative feedback that people write is libelous so can be removed without fuss. 'There's no way it's genuine' - that kind of stuff. The only feedback we are goosed on is how the customer feels.

    She does not have much feedback so is still a bit inexperienced perhaps. We have about 4500 'feedbacks' now over 3 ebay accounts. The longer you do it, the more you just want to nip the problem in the bud. Particularly when your ebay business starts getting busy.
     
  9. Mike Reed

    Mike Reed pfm Member

    Thanks for your informative reply, Richard and good point about phoning, as emails tend to get confusing through Ebay. Silly situation that I have the record she cannot sell (and it seems that she's now taken that off) and she has the record already purchased. I don't want to invoke Ebay and shall try to resolve this between us.

    DOCTORF I am not familiar with Ebay situations and resolution procedure and feel that would be my last step in light of Richard's post above.
     
  10. steve watkins

    steve watkins pfm Member

    The returns procedure on ebay is extremely easy, does no one any harm and keeps ebay informed step by step which is useful in the event of a problem.
    You request a return and a returns label for the reasons stated and the seller will send you a returns label to print and attach to the item. You then drop it off at the Post Office. It is ebay issued and tracked so if it goes astray it is not a problem for you.
    It takes a little time for each step but in my experience it works well when sellers have made a mistake and you do not wish to get involved in more expense or responsibility for someone elses error.
    Click on purchase history and then view the boxes on the right hand side click on contact seller/ item not as described and away you go.
     
  11. richgilb

    richgilb pfm Member

    Unfortunately the returns procedure usually does not have the appropriate option avaialable to me, the seller. For example, I often need this one:

    Seller accepts the return but buyer pays the return postage.

    This is required often. So the return procedure turns into a mess for both parties if the buyer opens a return and the appropriate option is not available. There are other scenarios where I cannot choose one of the three options, such as an irate customer, where I might refund immediately, and require the item is returned after the refund. The options available are here and they are not good enough.

    1. Accept Return. Seller should pay the return cost and decides if he would like to buy a return label on eBay or send his own label. Please wait until the item arrives and then arrange for the refund to the buyer.

    2. Full refund. You will arrange a full refund to the buyer to close this request. The buyer keeps the item.

    3. Partial refund offer. You can make an offer once. The buyer keeps the item.

    Which one of those 3 is applicable here? If none, you end up messaging each other and sorting it outside the returns procedure anyway. Or worse, you ask ebay to intervene becasue none fit. And this affects your account status.

    Also bear in mind, ebay and paypal monitor returns and refunds. It is a metric that affects both buyer and seller status. And so your score starts off good but the more you do stuff like this the more to your detriment. We can't get paypal loans because of the returns issue. And we suffer less than 10% returns. Clothing runs at 30%. So it make us consider refunding people by sending them cash.

    Keep away from the corporates wherever possible! They're not here to help us.
     
  12. doctorf

    doctorf left footed right winger

    The OP is getting opinions from people on both sides of the argument.
    As a seller, I suspect returns etc are just a pain. For the buyer, eBay returns seem very easy and save the sorts of hassle that the OP is experiencing. Buyers do themselves no favours by trying to be nice and then finding that not everyone is as nice as they are.
     
  13. steve watkins

    steve watkins pfm Member

    As far as Mike is concerned, if offered, any one of the three he finds acceptable. It is not really his problem. The seller made a mistake and should stand the cost to quickly rectify the situation.
    There is little worse than a seller who will not promptly correct their own mistakes and keeps dragging it out. As soon as it becomes apparent I shop elsewhere and let ebay deal with it. It is about the the only time I leave negative feedback and it guarantees no future business. It will always be a judgement as to which option they offer and they may well lose whatever the item cost and any postage but they made the mistake. It is presumably often better to accept the loss and retain the ability to supply the correct item if possible and offset the profit to minimise any loss.
    It is unfortunate but presumably they will now organise themselves and perhaps create a system to prevent it happening again.
    I have more sympathy for items correctly supplied, where the seller has not made errors but that is presumably a different situation and debate, to the one in question.
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2017
  14. Ragaman

    Ragaman pfm Member

    Open a return case, simples.
    The seller pays return postage costs, the seller will send a label to print.

    Could not be simpler.
     
    Mr Cat likes this.
  15. MikeMA

    MikeMA pfm Member

    If all else fails you could engage a "no win no fee" lawyer.
     
  16. Ciunas Audio

    Ciunas Audio Trade: Ciunas Audio

    From a seller perspective, one has to be careful about returns.

    I sent the wrong product (USB-SPDIF) to an active member & blogger on a US forum when he had ordered a USB-DAC. The next day I realised it was the wrong product & I informed him. As he had organised a meet up & he wanted to have the DAC for demo, I sent him the DAC & told him I would pay for his postage of the USB-SPDIF back (& give him a discount for his trouble).

    He refused to send the device back stating that according to US law he was entitled to keep the wrong product sent to him as it was considered 'soliciting'.
     
  17. Mike Reed

    Mike Reed pfm Member

    Just an update and thanks to all. As Steve Watkins says (thanks Steve), the returns label procedure is pretty straightforward, if a little confusing. For example, despite using their 'wrong item sent' category, they ask that I return the original purchase item (with a picture of it). How silly is that ?

    I am returning the wrong record today with EBay's Tracked 48 label, and the correct record is currently in the post to me, I'm told. I just hope she packs this one securely ! Hopefully things are being sorted, but what a lot of extra expense for the seller and inconvenience/time on both sides simply by not paying attention to detail. Shall update further when all is done and dusted. Yet again the power of collective pfm advice and experience triumphs. This has to be the best hifi forum; at least, when the colours and clarity regain something approaching their former glory.
     

Share This Page