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BBC 7 ages of Rock - starts Saturday

Discussion in 'music' started by prowla, May 18, 2007.

  1. The Captain

    The Captain ~~~~~~~~~~

    I can guarantee The Zutons album is complete rubbish with a silly parping sax to compound one's misery of hearing bland revamped pseudo US 60s pop/rock shtick: truly appaling music from what I keep hearing on the radio. My snobbery will now cease :D.
     
  2. RickyC6

    RickyC6 Infuriate the frog-men

    Captain - agree with your list barring Franz Ferdinand who I rate as "really quite good" (as per Sgt Wilson in Dad's Army).

    Cheers
    Rich
    PS did ya get my Paypal for the Pistols DVD?
     
  3. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    Said parping sax player is rather aesthetically pleasing though.

    I have their first album and it is edging ever closer to the pfm record shop as I've only played it once. The problem being that I also own Josef K's The Only Fun In Town and Gang Of Four's Entertainment...

    Tony.
     
  4. The Captain

    The Captain ~~~~~~~~~~

    Not too sure me.. I think she might well have her own 'hairy' website.. oops I think thats me done for.

    Look, go back put the FranzFerdinand cd on and afterwards face it squarely- you WANT to like it.. but it really its just crap. Snobbery finally over now.
     
  5. The Captain

    The Captain ~~~~~~~~~~

    Not too sure me.. I think she might well have her own 'hairy' website.. oops I think thats me done for.

    Look, go back put the FranzFerdinand cd on and afterwards face it squarely- you WANT to like it.. but it really its just crap. Snobbery finally over now.

    Rich- Pistols dvd on its way. Pistols.. FFerdinand: Rhino.. fluffy (lame) kitten.
     
  6. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    I bought it when it first came out as I liked the way that Josef K-alike song slowed down in the middle. I later realised that slowing down in the middle wasn't sufficient reason to keep liking something and the media saturation since has ensured I'm now thoroughly bored with said stunt. It's a vinyl copy so might even be worth a quid or two by now...

    Tony.
     
  7. Anex

    Anex Señor Member

    I don't need your guarantees of anything thanks, your snobbery doesn't work on me. There is far worse stuff going on than the first Zutons album. It's not meant to be anything other than revamped 60's pop.
     
  8. prowla

    prowla pfm Member

    I like the Zutons version of "Valerie", and the sax player sure looks better than most.
     
  9. The Captain

    The Captain ~~~~~~~~~~

    Thinking about the last 7 ages prog, and getting back on track, it was right in highlighting that the indie scene had become the mainstream, and contrary to what someone said here, it did correctly and interestingly conclude with The Libertines efforts to counter this by use of t'internet as a true meaning of independent music again. It indeed didn't mention Peel which is unforgiveable thinking of it, but perhaps as my horrorlist shows there wasn't anything really post Smiths to write home about (bar PJH- omitted- not only a solitary female amongst the white bloke bands, but Imo the best Independent band during this period). Q: how many on my horrorlist during his time of course, had so much as the briefest session on John Peel's show?
     
  10. RickyC6

    RickyC6 Infuriate the frog-men

    Only Twang, The Verve & The Boo Radleys did Peel sessions. But to be fair quite a few on your list came to prominence after the great man passed away. Oh and by the way the Boo Radleys were a great band...

    Cheers
    Rich
     
  11. The Captain

    The Captain ~~~~~~~~~~

    The Twangers didnt. So thats just 2?

    The Stone Roses.. now thats what great Uk independent music's all about. Good reminder of their fantastic debut album on the programme. Am I right that Primal Scream bassist same chap? surely not.
     
  12. muzzer

    muzzer Numb Nut

    Yes it is the same Mani.
     
  13. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    This particular program was IMHO even more flawed by design than the others as it was based on a logical impossibility – the stadium filling small band / the popular niche / the non-obscure obscure. Indie by definition exists entirely outside of the mainstream – it can not be treated the way one approaches Queen or Led Zeppelin.

    PJ Harvey is in reality no less obscure than Mogwai, Arab Strap, Stereolab, Piano Magic, Half Man Half Biscuit, Godspeed You Black Emperor, Giant Sand, Peaches, Yo La Tengo, Granddady, Couch, Devendra Banhart, Sigor Ros, Müm or any of the countless other wonderful, diverse and truly innovative independent acts they (and apparently you) overlooked.

    I agree that many of today’s top pop bands are bland dilutions and corporate refinement of long-past indie styles. This does not make them ‘indie’ in the slightest. They are not at all representative of the current underground scene. The notion the Libertines ‘brought it back’ was utter bullshit that could only be spouted by those who had entirely lost touch with what was happening at grass roots level. It had never been away.

    Tony.
     
  14. The Captain

    The Captain ~~~~~~~~~~

    No no hang on Tony- Im referring specifically to Uk Indie as this episode did here. Yo La Tengo, Peaches, Sigor Ross.. not relally part of discussing the last programme. I certainly haven't overlooked Mogwai or Arab Strap or Stereolab some of which Ive got (to me though Smiths, Stone Roses and PJH do stand out a mile) -referring to what I like was not my point- but the reams of nondescipt stuff, the majority of which the programme reminded me was the start of it, and Imo the reason so much blandness is abound in UK now: the easy, lazy ticket that just making so-so music can mean big band success- and, depressingly, it seems to be true by the looks of it.

    Id argue that FFerdinand by virtue of simply being on Domino however popular they are, or will be, makes them still definitely independent too, as Oasi* on Creation were still an indie band- their massive success doesnt alter their labels' inherrant design though.

    The prog didn't emphasise the small but still functioning ind scene (as it should be) you refer to as it was so dwarfed by the mainstreaming of the 'lead' bands, & so too small to refer to in context of an hour show; it didn't say it had died, but rather emphasised its having been swallowed up (and hence forgotten by the media) until a new angle/ approach did come to the media's attn by way of a totally new fresh, and fundamentally pure way of independence- word of mouth via t'internet.... to give the prog its limited credit Imo (It still had NoelG spieling for 2/ 3rds of it).
     
  15. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    Ok, I get confused as they keep on shifting between a UK and international perspective (i.e. Nirvana / REM etc). I could still list a shed load of UK bands I consider to be wonderful. There is no lack of them.

    SAW was an independent label, did that make Jason Donovan an indie act? I stick to my earlier argument that say Oasis are not remotely ‘indie’ despite being on Creation - their blend of Beatles influenced stadium rock is arguably more mainstream and commercial than anything U2 ever released. FF are a distillation and commercialisation of the indie music of 25 to 30 years ago IMHO. Gang Of Four / Josef K with the edges smoothed flat and the point removed.

    Tony.
     
  16. matthewr

    matthewr spɹɐʍʞɔɐq spɹoɔǝɹ ɹnoʎ sʎɐld

    It seems a bit odd to slag Oasis off for doing Beatles and T-Rex impersonations and then laud the Stone Roses for doing much the same with The Byrds.
     
  17. The Captain

    The Captain ~~~~~~~~~~

    Fair point Matthewr.. but I Am The Resurection is so central to UK indie, the crossover to the Manc Hacienda scene etc, that just that half a song puts them musically more innovative/ important than every oasi* song put together! besides The Stone Roses lp started a distinct sound starting the whole 'baggy' manc scene. Oasi*? merely churned out plain rock ballads.

    Jason Donovan IS the godfather of indie yes (or is that just Donovan?).

    Anyway I guess as per other arguaments in music both sides could be correct Tony on the indie where it begins/ stops arguuament- but even in Wembley shed they're still on Domino who choose obviously to have non-mainstream bands on.. so if their 1st lp sales are typically low they're indie, but if they get a radio hit and the lp sells well they're suddenly not? maybe its a round and round debate this one..
     
  18. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    That’s not what I’m trying to do at all. I see both the Stone Roses and Oasis as good pop bands. Neither brought much that was truly new and innovative to the table IMHO but both turned out some great songs. I’m not slagging them off at all, and I actually see them as being quite alike. I’m just arguing the toss over semantics, i.e. can something underground ever become mainstream without compromise? Does the mainstream require the comfort zone of familiarity inherent in The Stone Roses, Oasis or Franz Ferdinand? Did people like Oasis because they liked The Beatles? What is indie again?

    Tony.
     
  19. prowla

    prowla pfm Member

    I don't get the "Oasis sound like the Beatles" thing - they don't.
     
  20. RickyC6

    RickyC6 Infuriate the frog-men

    There was another Twang back in '86 who did some Peel sesh's!

    Stone Roses were great and Mani is a great guy - I got pissed with him and Guigsy (original Oasis bassist) one night in the V&A hotel in Manchester about 5 years ago. Mani was sound - Guigsy was an arrogant twunt.

    Cheers

    Rich
     

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