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Buying a used car - VAG 1.0 and 1.2 TSI petrol engines

Discussion in 'off topic' started by nicetone, May 14, 2019.

  1. Tony Lockhart

    Tony Lockhart pfm Member

    They were caught.
    Every manufacturer will have skellingtons in their cupboard, and a few of us aren’t going to bring down such a big company.
    gintonic likes this.
  2. tuga

    tuga European

    We can (and should) stop buying from them (at least until they only sell extremelly low emission cars - ideally they should buy all the TDI cr@ap that they sold us).

    The damage has been done and it's irreversible; should we just forget about it? Why? Just because their cars look pretty, their logos give us status, or we are (blind) brand followers?
  3. Sue Pertwee-Tyr

    Sue Pertwee-Tyr pfm Member

    Yes but I agree, in principle, with Tuga. If skullduggery doesn't have commercial consequences in the marketplace (leaving aside regulatory consequences) then there is a risk the regulatory stuff just gets costed in as a cost of doing business. The market has to punish wrongdoing, too, or market leaders will just carry on.
    tuga likes this.
  4. stevec67

    stevec67 pfm Member

    Most people will, for exactly these reasons. VW have persuaded the UK market that they are a premium brand, they aren't regarded as such in Germany, which is both interesting and amusing. Thank you Ramesh. I'll help myself to a confectionery item to the left of the Double Deckers.
  5. stevec67

    stevec67 pfm Member

    I don't think he is, he said "Almost certainly post 2015" so only 4 years old tops. That's why I said go older, he's just had a nice simple 2005 Lancer that he's taken to 165k miles, why not have more of the same? Say 6 or 7 years old, nice and cheap, keep it till it dies.
    Tony Lockhart likes this.
  6. tuga

    tuga European

    What if they hadn't been caught?
    Snufkin likes this.
  7. Tony Lockhart

    Tony Lockhart pfm Member

    My mistake. Too much going on at once :)
  8. Sue Pertwee-Tyr

    Sue Pertwee-Tyr pfm Member

    To be fair, though, if they hadn't been caught, the market wouldn't punish them either...
  9. Tony Lockhart

    Tony Lockhart pfm Member


    In the past I’ve known people who’d never buy German because of the holocaust. Or Japanese because of their treatment of PoWs. Or French because of their Pacific nuclear tests. Or Korean because of that nation’s dietary preferences. Or certain major American names because of their appalling treatment of customers injured/killed due to design flaws.

    And, of course, every single vehicle bought is killing the planet.

    So, do I take moral guidance from anyone here who feels fit to single out one manufacturer?

    Naa. Not me.
    Mr Cat and cutting42 like this.
  10. Sue Pertwee-Tyr

    Sue Pertwee-Tyr pfm Member

    But I think you might accept that there is a difference between 'never' buying Japanese, because of the Bridge over the River Kwai, and 'boycotting' VW because it has behaved disgracefully and misled its customers and the regulators? The boycott doesn't need to be permanent, either, but should last enough to smart a bit, and occur at the same time as the events it responds to.
    tuga likes this.
  11. stevec67

    stevec67 pfm Member

    My bike isn't. :) About 20k miles so far, at a cost of a few tyres, several chains, 4 wheels, a few other oily bits and what seems like several hundred sets of brake blocks. It delivers about 20 miles to a bowl of porridge and last night's beer.
    nicetone, tuga, Snufkin and 1 other person like this.
  12. I.D.C.

    I.D.C. pfm Member

    My own experience of TSI engines is very good they are nippy, refined and great on fuel. Mine is the 1,4 150bhp. Had a GTI TSI also. Never any engine problems my next car will be a TSI also. Make sure you see the service history before a deal is done.
    nicetone likes this.
  13. nicetone

    nicetone pfm Member

    Thanks everyone - a lot of food for thought.

    Jap cars - I actually started out thinking I’d go Japanese again, given how good the Mitsubishi has been, owned 11 yrs from 40k on the clock and now 169,500 without problems until the current one.

    However, I’d been hoping that cars from VAG being so widely owned would mean easy access to spares and knowledgeable independent repairers. They’re also, widely available for sale - I bought my present car, found on-line, from a main dealer 80miles away, but I tend to think that in 2019, used (and new) cars are more likely to have problems, meaning I need to buy relatively local. The Honda, Toyota, petrol, manual estates I’ve seen for sale, are fewer and often some distance away.

    Some factors I took into account, but without detailing everything for each make/model. Hondas have the Vtec engines - no doubt great while they’re working, but long term, I‘m wary. Also, repairers for that tech(?). Maybe not an issue with my low annual mileage. Accords are mostly old and high mileages. Civics, I’m not keen - presented as sporty - don‘t appeal. Both models, the ones I’ve seen on line, have 17inch wheels, a no, no for me. But I do appreciate Honda attributes, having had a bullet proof Honda engine in a Rover which I turned in at 169,000mls, only due to rust, having had it since 64k.

    Toyota Auris (Jap but assembled in UK) - I could re-look at, if I felt it best to abort the quest for SEAT and Skoda. However, again I would likely need to travel far (but won’t). Avensis is a bit big - I want Astra/Focus/Golf class where the estate is not much but usefully bigger (okay, Octavia is larger but still on the Golf platform) than the hatchback and near enough the same on fuel economy. Auris - despite the reputation for good reliability (meaning they hold higher prices) I’m still wary of the VVT engines as I am the Honda Vtec. It could well be though that I just have to accept this is the way things are now, and choose which complex tech option to go with.

    Suzuki - IMO a great make, but there’s no estate car in the line-up.

    SUVs are a turn-off for me. I also want to avoid blacked out rear windows, electric parking brakes, and thief friendly keyless door entry/ignition, which I can, with a lower tech spec 2015 SEAT or 2018 Skoda.

    I also looked through Astra, Focus, Hyundai, Kia, and Fiat Tipo estates. Astra/Fiat - reliability concerns (though liked the idea of the Astra, it being assembled at Ellesmere Port) and, in the case of Fiat, fuel economy. Focus, Hyundai and Kia, not a huge issue, but, if I’m choosing, I didn’t particularly take to them. They too appear to hold good prices so not such good value. However, I could well (would have to) re-look at them if my SEAT/Skoda choice starts to appear flawed.

    Last edited: May 16, 2019
  14. nicetone

    nicetone pfm Member

    Interesting Steve, I hadn’t realised the Focus petrol was still non-turbo in 2010.

    I’d more or less decided, having briefly pondered a 2011 low mileage BMW, to get something more recent. Having bought the Mitsi at 3.5yrs old, I like the idea of a buying a car with similar years again, no older than 2015.

    A 2010 car feels a bit too close to the age of the one I’m moving from, and a quick look at the Focus prices on Auto Trader shows typically £3,500 - £3,800 and 100,000 mls approx, with lower mileage cars say 60-70,000 at £5k upwards. Not sure about that value proposition and I’d rather pay more for newer/fresher if I can convince myself that it would be reliable and longer lasting than say a 2010 Focus - the madness is that it might not be!

    I have myself been a disciple of bangernomics in the past, but not at prices in the £‘000s (my 40,000 mile Mitsi was only £4.2k). My best banger deal was the car before the Mitsi, a 1993 Mk1 Mondeo 1.8 bought in 2005 for £350 including fifty quids worth of tax, 109,000 mls on the clock. I p/x’d it in 2008 at 178,000 miles, the only costs having been servicing (by me), tyres, and a part exhaust. Not a remarkable drive, but certainly okay, and a few niggles which I ‘drove through’ (ignored). Only 35ish to the gallon. But, I could have spent £2-3,000 on something no better and a money pit. Great car!!

    I wouldn’t completely rule out a 2010 car if I have to re-think my plans, but I’d prefer something newer with the aim of not having to decide every couple of years whether the point had been reached to not spend any money it and move on to something else.


    (I’m going off-line shortly; should be coming back at some point this evening.)
  15. Nero

    Nero It's unlikely

    My goto place for Audi servicing used to be Total VAG in Leighton Buzzard. Always made me smile when I went there :)

    on topic, my only experience with their petrol engines is ones with 6 or 8 cylinders, so I can't help the OP. But I've always found the TFSI series excellent
  16. Jamie

    Jamie pfm Member

    I would worry about the latest small turbo petrol engines, especially the 3 cylinder ones. A colleague had a Focus ecoboost, not many miles, big problem, £4k repair bill. My hairdressers boyfriend had a 4 or so year old VW (not sure if it was a Golf or Polo), which he scrapped for some sort of engine problem which was not economic to repair. Later this year, we are looking to replace my wife's Qashqai (2 litre petrol, 2008, owned from new, only 55k on the clock). I think we will be looking at Mazda SUV, with a similar size (ie, proper) petrol engine. May be a bit thirsty, but more chance it will last a good time like the Qashqai. We will probably keep it for me, as my 11 year old Focus (1.6 Zetec) is getting a bit tired after 145k on the clock.
    nicetone likes this.
  17. Tony Lockhart

    Tony Lockhart pfm Member

    It would smart a bit if hundreds of thousands of people across Europe stopped buying VW products, but all that’d do is allow the Koreans to take an even larger chunk of our collective wallets.
  18. Ali T

    Ali T pfm Member

    Seriously? I run a 2.7 twin turbo V6 diesel and get mid to high 40’s MPG on the motorway. To get 35 MPG at best from a 1.6 is abysmal frankly, and when I say gutless, I mean exactly that- as in you put your foot down and you get more noise from the engine but nothing else happens..

    By contrast I drove a few years ago a 1.0 Micra which really surprised me by how nippy it was.
  19. stevec67

    stevec67 pfm Member

    You're dead right that £3500 is too much for a 9yo 100k mile Focus. That's a £1000 banger, 1500 tops. I paid £1k last year for a 2008 jag diesel, 108k or similar. I wouldn't pay 3k for one 2 years newer, no way. The good news is that the pre Ecoboost non turbo 1.6 to 2L range lasted to 2015 according to Wiki so there will be a sweet spot for price/age/condition/mileage to suit you. I think the other brands ke pt ordinary boring petrol engines available until then at least too. That's what I would choose.
  20. Tony Lockhart

    Tony Lockhart pfm Member

    Did you buy it?

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