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Discussion in 'off topic' started by SteveS1, Feb 13, 2020.

  1. SteveS1

    SteveS1 I heard that, pardon?

    All over the news today. A big problem sure enough. Que the outrage, demands for stiffer penalities etc. But have a google at the trend of costs and hassle involved in legitimate disposal of household and industrial waste - then look at the trend in illegal disposal. Who'd have thought eh?

    This is of course a cost effectively transferred to private residents and local authorities, so chances of anything useful being done? That'll be none.
    sean99 and Snufkin like this.
  2. richgilb

    richgilb Admonishtrator

    According to pfm economic outlook, the problem will go away soon, since nobody will be buying any new stuff any more.
  3. thebigfredc

    thebigfredc pfm Member

    Bring back the birch.
  4. Suffolk Tony

    Suffolk Tony Aim low, achieve your goals, avoid disappointment.

    For some strange, obscure reason, when our local council started to charge for the disposal of bags of rubble at the tip, the incidence of fly-tipping in the area went up enormously. It's a mystery I tell you!
  5. manicatel

    manicatel pfm Member

    Yes, equally strangely, when our local recycling centre decided to close 3 days a week, fly tipping increased. Another unfathomable mystery.
  6. stevec67

    stevec67 pfm Member

    They'll probably get away with crucifixion.
  7. Mike Reed

    Mike Reed pfm Member

    You've probably nailed it there, Steve!

    What baffles me, not to mention the above and anybody who ponders the problem, is that the authorities don't seem to see the correlation. Alternatively, they're so stuffed with self-righteous indignation that they are bureaucratically blinded. Surely, it's more cost-effective to offer free or low-cost and convenient facilities than to clear up the mess afterwards.
  8. SteveS1

    SteveS1 I heard that, pardon?

    I think part of the problem is that it isn't the people who make the disposal difficult who pick up the tab. Indeed, a large part falls to the owners of the land if they can get away with it.
    glancaster likes this.
  9. dudywoxer

    dudywoxer pfm Member

    going through the required hoops to get a permit to take a private non sign written van to the tip is painful. To then find the number of items that are charged for increasing almost monthly. If you want to take a hire van in, maybe when moving home, you need to start the booking in process about a month in advance. There is now mumbling about charging for garden waste, both for collection from home, and at the tip. As most of this stuff is composted and used by the council, or sold to the public in seems to be a pay/pay situation. I wonder why fly tipping is on the increase.
  10. Snufkin

    Snufkin pfm Member

    Its all down to the Tories squeezing Local Authorities, who in turn try to squeeze their constituents, who in turn hand the problem back to land owners who benefit from 'austerity' by our failure to tax land properly. I think its called poetic justice.
  11. tonerei

    tonerei pfm Member

    I understand the need to charge. Polluter pays.
    But implementing and enforcing is too difficult.
    A lot of lazy people around. Even when bins are provided and are free the effort for a lot of people to even manage to put their stuff in a bin is just too much for them. Maybe Boris could try and build a bridge of communication to these people and get them to see the light just like he managed with Brexit
  12. Barrymagrec

    Barrymagrec pfm Member

    On a smaller scale, at the beginning of last year our council changed the collection system from weekly to fortnightly alternating general waste / recycling. They also put a limit of one wheelie bin for general waste whereas before some households put out multiple black bag every week. Since this change I have noticed a marked increase in bags of household waste dumped by the side of the road, over the park fence and so on.

    It is indeed inexplicable.
  13. scotty38

    scotty38 pfm Member

    I live in a rural area, 8 miles away from the nearest tip, the one 4 miles away closed... We suffer from some fly-tipping for all the reasons mentioned so far but the local authority is very good at getting it picked up to be fair. This is all wrong/annoying etc etc but what really gets my goat is folk dropping drinks cans/bottles, crisp wrappers, Macdonalds boxes and so on out of their car windows....That's just shitty humans plain and simple.
    jonesi, Fatmarley, Zeusum and 5 others like this.
  14. Thorn

    Thorn pfm Member

    We've got some well over-mature shrubs in our garden. Our gardener could cut them down and haul the branches away to our local tip in his pickup, but a pickup counts as a commercial vehicle, so he's barred from the tip.
    A few years ago they introduced residents' permits for the tip. Anyone who lives just outside the boundary lost access.
    Waste disposal should be made easier, not harder.
    Tarzan and Snufkin like this.
  15. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    Its simply awful around here. I used to volunteer now and again on the local environmental committee which at that time had some EU money to spend. We used it to clean neglected areas up, provide better wildlife sanctuaries etc. That was about 12 years ago, its all long gone now, plus a decade of Tory austerity has slashed the council to breaking point so the main person who was responsible for cleaning up fly-tipping and the local environment in general was made redundant. The area is now an utter shit-hole, rubbish everywhere, no one really responsible. If I cycle out on to the moors, around the reservoirs etc it gets little better, people will apparently drive out miles to ditch their shitty old sofas, broken fridges, stained mattresses etc.

    I firmly believe household waste disposal and recycling should be covered 100% under council tax, i.e. tips are free to access, home collection available for those unable to drive to them. No one should be put in the position where dumping their ugly unwanted crap into the local environment is the easiest option. I bet the cost of environmental cleanup (picking abandoned fridges and sofas up from half way up the Pennines etc) is actually far higher than offering this service under council tax too.
    jonesi, Snufkin, Ponty and 1 other person like this.
  16. SteveS1

    SteveS1 I heard that, pardon?

    No it’s not, it’s called turning the countryside, sports facilities, nature reserves, highways, people’s gardens and community spaces into a pig sty. There is no poetic justice in any of that. Oh and if they can be arsed to clear it up with no land owner to soak, it will be everyone who pays more.
  17. Bob McC

    Bob McC Living the life of Riley

  18. Vinny

    Vinny pfm Member

    HORRENDOUS problem around N Leics. Two types in the main - small scale domestic rubbish, including appliances, and garden waste, sometimes large scale from jobs like conifer removal.

    I have two free utility disposal sites within 5 miles of me (free to small trailer size that is) and people still dump stuff in fields and ditches, farm gateways and the like, not infrequently 100's of yards from one of the disposal sites. The only likely domestic waste that they will not take is liquid paint, which can be disposed of (also free) about 15 miles away, or you can let it dry out and then dispose locally.

    The garden waste trouble is likely associated with a certain section of society, who are plentiful around these parts, who routinely tout for any sort of business to turn a buck, you know, the ones keen on caravanning. The people putting jobs their way are legally and morally as much to blame.

    Trail cams and crunch the vehicles.

    BTW, many disposal sites are concessions - the people paying to run them make a living from them.
  19. Ponty

    Ponty pfm Member

    You’ve got to make it easy for people to get rid of stuff. Yes, it’s a symptom of over consumption but it needs dealing with. Making it more and more difficult and expensive to dispose of unwanted ‘stuff’ must surely cost the tax payer more in the long run. Of course, a big part of the problem is people using improper tradespeople to dispose of their crap in an attempt to save a few quid, knowing full well where it will end up. Scandalous.

    What’s often forgotten is that when rubbish is dumped on private land, it’s down to the landowner to pay for the clear up, or not. Used to have a tip a few miles away, closed down, now it’s a 24 mile round trip. I don’t see any fly tipping though, too many farmers wandering around with guns.
  20. Snufkin

    Snufkin pfm Member

    We will have to differ in our opinions about the reasons and consequences.

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