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Is it me or is it hard to sell you loved hifi bits these days

Discussion in 'audio' started by jasonski73, Nov 2, 2018.

  1. Darth Vader

    Darth Vader From the Dark Side

    ..........and 'output bottles' or just 'bottles' for those big glowing valves (sometimes blue as well as red!) in our guitar amps such as KT88, KT66, 6550 etc.......


  2. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    In your bizarre high-end Naim/Leica-owning safe middle-class bourgeoisie version of communism what is actually wrong with providing everyone with affordable and simple ways to enjoy simply massive catalogues of music in high quality?! I’d wager far more folk can afford a contract iPhone and a subscription to Apple Music (or Tidal, Spotify etc) than our £20k+ hi-fis and large record collections! For me anything that opens music up to more people legally (i.e. whilst still paying the artists) is a very good thing indeed. I personally still prefer purchasing a hard copy to play on my fancy stereo, but I am in a comparatively privileged position of being easily able to afford to do so. I’m also not a communist/anti-capitalist!
    Jonboi, Tim Jones, booja30 and 2 others like this.
  3. Konteebos

    Konteebos Ignorant Uninformed Hard Remainer

    Interestingly, when I advertised my Linn Ninkas on here there wasn't any interest, but I stuck them on the sale page on a watch forum and they sold in hours. I've noticed watches being sold on here, too so maybe we just need to sell our hi-fi to watch freaks and vice versa?
  4. Hcanning

    Hcanning pfm Member

    eBay. Crap budget 1980s speakers and amps sell for far more than they're worth on there, let alone decent stuff.
  5. Minio

    Minio pfm Member

    In the eyes of economists hifi is known as an inferior product. Amps and speakers are old tech on a burgeoning secondhand market.

    I don’t think that necessarily means that the species known as “audiophiles “ are becoming extinct.

    Please remember these are only views held by a few nerds on a thread and aren’t necessarily hard facts. And most of all, don’t have nightmares!
  6. simon g

    simon g Grumpy Old Man

    Spot on. I have a couple of systems that would be considred expensive by many, and very good they are too. However, as I write this I'm listening to Da Pacen Domine via my iPad and AirPods and Apple Music. I woul most likely never have discovered this without this modern technology and music services. OK, SQ isn't top quality, but it's certainly good enough. If more people can experience the power of music then surely that's a good thing?
  7. monty

    monty pfm Member

    I walked into Vickers, a bit further down from SO and walked out with a Gyro with QC. Still have it now (25 years later) albeit it has been upgraded.
    I gave my 4,000+ CD's to charity and now only use LP and streaming via Roon. :)
  8. cjyosemite

    cjyosemite pfm Member

    I think this largely sums up my own position. I have 4 systems of various makes of "good" quality" but equallly considered to be "good value" but in truth I cannot say that any system is better than the others. Out of all the kit, speakers have the biggest influence by far, but it is the music which really matters & the music I like sounds brilliant whilst the music I do not like sounds awful, irrespective of the kit.
  9. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    I was exceptionally lucky as I was able to put a proper hi-fi system together whilst in my mid teens, one that would still be respected now (Lenco L75, Quad 33/303, JR149s). To this day I still think the 303 and 149s are a wonderful combination that easily stand comparison to quite expensive modern alternatives, so I started off well, certainly in a whole different league to my peers who usually had Dansettes or worse cheap Fidelity stereos (kind of like a Crossley). I also had a pair of Sennheiser HD-414 headphones I connected to the 303 via a little QED box. Even so I bet that system (i.e. with the rudimentary Lenco arm and a Shure M75EJ) wouldn’t have come close to matching a loseless file on an iPhone with a similar quality pair of headphones (not HD-414s as they are extraordinarily inefficient and the iPhone can’t drive them, I know this as I still have a pair!). Source first holds true always, and today it is the specific digital mastering.

    Far more significantly my record collection at this point would likely have been between 50 and 100 LPs. I started buying vinyl early, saving my dinner money all week so I could go second had vinyl shopping at the weekend. I had a paper round too. That was my entire world view, a foot or so of vinyl! Contrast and compare that with Apple Music, Spotify, Tidal etc, or even just YouTube. A similarly obsessive kid with an inquisitive ear for music today can access the whole of recorded music history within a few clicks. It is a whole different world.

    I’d still want a pair of nice speakers as I just prefer them to headphones, but I’d really like to know where I’d have ended up had I the ability to access so much music as a kid/teenager.
    kjb likes this.
  10. booja30

    booja30 pfm Member

    But if people pay some amount for something, isn't that effectively what it's worth?
  11. tiggers

    tiggers pfm Member

    This is absolutely spot on. My partner's daughter who is 12 is really getting into music. She loves leafing through my CD collection (2000 plus) and asking me about different CDs etc. but now she has discovered Spotify and Tidal and is in a world where there are almost infinite amounts of music at the touch of a button and in reasonable quality too. She appreciates my system quality wise (and uses it sometimes), but overall she listens via iPad/iPhone and a decent pair of Sennheisers. She is now starting to find more and more music from the 70s, 80s and 90s and whereas I was initially a reference she can use the Internet to find out more about the music she is listening to and what else she might like. She's currently reliving the rave era with Orbital.... not sure her mother approves of my waxing lyrical about how good the 'all night discos' were in the 90s ;) I would have killed to have access to that much music when I was growing up... and people say the world hasn't changed for the better... in some ways it has.
  12. Sibbers

    Sibbers pfm Member

    the thing I dislike about Spotify is I don’t have mates telling me about music they’ve discovered and having those wow moments. Also I forget what I love listening to sometimes and don’t get the opportunity to rediscover stuff as often. I think access to so much music can in some ways be limiting.

    I often wonder how much of a computer nerd I would have become if I were born 20 years later. I feel like the difficulty in pursuing gave me as much as it resisted.
    topa and Snufkin like this.
  13. Snufkin

    Snufkin pfm Member

    I think with music, less is more in one sense. When I was younger and had few records, each purchase was considered carefully and listened to much more intently than today when I have access to so much more. I don't stream or listen to music online so can't comment on that experience but still get those wow moments when i am introduced to something that really touches me so I guess I am lucky.
    Sibbers, ToTo Man and Rallye_punk like this.
  14. Rallye_punk

    Rallye_punk pfm Member

    Yes you can buy some nicely 'retro' styled modern solutions, but it's not quite the same, a true aficionado will always opt for the genuine article ;) It's like having an MR2 with a Ferarri body kit! :D

    Interesting points above regarding spotify etc. I think it's great you can access so much music but there is also a negative side. I use Spoitfy a lot these days and also recently saved all my CD's to a Naim unitiserve, however, I find that I listened to them more often and a greater variety when they were on a shelf and I could actually see them and physically touch them. In some weird way it makes you appreciate it more, I don't really know why...it's like having records to play too. With spotify I seem to listen to the same thing or internet radio most of the time. Having access to everything instantly kind of gives an overload on the senses and you tend to lose the appreciation somewhat, I can't really put it into words but I am sure some of you will understand what I mean.
  15. stevec67

    stevec67 pfm Member

    You mean like Lehmann Bros shares were "worth" however many dollars a share prior to the crash, and plenty of people bought them, and then worthless the next day?

    Back OT - I don't think it's hard to sell interesting stuff, or ordinary stuff at the right price. There was a tonearm for sale on here that I'd never heard of. Some piece of exotica, at an exotic price. £1700 I think. Advertised Wednesday, one post, sold today. Done. What is difficult to sell is an average-to-battered Rega 2 for £150. There's more used and abused stuff out there than there is loved and unmarked, and the demand is for the latter.

    On records - I don't find it easy to browse on online music. There's no flipping through the racks experience, or not that I've seen. One thing I miss from Amazon as was years ago was that they used to have a side bar of "have you tried?" You would look for, say, Led Zep CDs, on the side you'd have Tull, Bert Jansch, from there Fairport, Pentangle and on for ever. If Spotify had a suggestions box it would be great. Rolling Stones backwards to Willie Dixon, Bo Diddley, Robert Johnson, then forwards to Primal Scream, and plenty of other things en route.
    hairyderriere likes this.
  16. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    I know what you mean, e.g. I doubt I’ll ever know an album the way I know say Electric Warrior or The Slider, which were two of the first albums I owned, but the ability to instantly access a whole world of Blue Note, Impulse, Miles Davis, Bach, minimalism etc may have opened my eyes to where I’ve ended up far sooner. I’m certain the only reason I didn’t listen to the stuff I play all the time now as a kid is that I didn’t know it existed! I bet I’d have ‘got’ say Miles Davis In A Silent Way, Get Up With It etc as a 13 year old had it appeared on my radar.
  17. rockingdoc

    rockingdoc pfm Member

    “I don't find it easy to browse on online music. There's no flipping through the racks experience, or not that I've seen. One thing I miss from Amazon as was years ago was that they used to have a side bar of "have you tried?" You would look for, say, Led Zep CDs, on the side you'd have Tull, Bert Jansch, from there Fairport, Pentangle and on for ever. If Spotify had a suggestions box it would be great. Rolling Stones backwards to Willie Dixon, Bo Diddley, Robert Johnson, then forwards to Primal Scream, and plenty of other things en route.”

    That would be Roon you are looking for
  18. booja30

    booja30 pfm Member

    It''s up to buyers and sellers to establish prices for used gear, so yes, like that. How do you think prices are determined for used gear?

    And yes, this is related to the original topic. Recognizing that there are a limited number of people that want the thing you're selling, and it might not be worth at the moment (based on economy, obsolescence, foo) what people hoped for. So you can sell an item for what someone is willing to pay for it now, or you can wait it out and see if things change.
  19. stevec67

    stevec67 pfm Member

    Partly by inherent worth and quality, and partly by fashion. Look at what's happened to record players recently. What's odd is that there are still Cinderella brands out there. How the hell is a Thorens TD150 worth less than a Rega 2? How the hell is a Nait 3 worth 3x a Quad 33-303? It's not even as good!
  20. Minio

    Minio pfm Member

    I'm a it puzzled by the lack of suggestions that some guys are attributing to Spotify.

    It spews them forth endlessly. "If you liked that then you'll like this" and whole lists of stuff load as you play.

    But, as sort of mentioned, the temptation of curiosity means you become overloaded with so much musical choice and don't settle into a whole album.

    Unlike the old days when you actually went out and bought an LP and listened to it inside out and then played it again till you knew every track thoroughly.
    Snufkin likes this.

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