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Is it worth buying new releases on vinyl?

Discussion in 'music' started by Peter McDermott, Feb 9, 2019.

  1. Peter McDermott

    Peter McDermott pfm Member

    I'm listening to Sharon Van Etten's Remind Me Tomorrow on my turntable (Rega P3) and its sound quality is pretty muddy. I've bought a few new releases on vinyl over the last year or so but have been underwhelmed. On the other hand I bought a secondhand copy of Rickie Lee Jones' Pirates and that sounds great.

    Remind Me Tomorrow comes in pink vinyl and has a very heavy cardboard gatefold sleeve so looks great/ very striking, but sounds better on Spotify.

    Is it all a bit of a con?
     
  2. Snufkin

    Snufkin pfm Member

    Its a Curates Egg - good in parts; some recent pressings sound good others less so. The short run and the packaging that new releases tend to have on LP makes them desirable but if they don't sound good then it just seems 'wrong'.
     
  3. Weekender

    Weekender pfm Member

    Case by case.
    The recent 2 x 45 release of Music from the Big Pink was excellent. Hounds of Love underwhelming.
    Mind neither of them are new releases and I tend to buy CD over vinyl purely for economics these days.
     
  4. Peter McDermott

    Peter McDermott pfm Member

    Hi Weekender, CD is the main format i use too.

    I'm not well-informed about the technical side of things but do new recording methods have an impact on what can be expected from new vinyl releases?
     
  5. Weekender

    Weekender pfm Member

    Hi Peter.
    I think the problem with the poorer end of new vinyl is it is boshed out as cheaply as possible with no care in the mastering/pressing. Hopefully a Techie will be along shortly to expand on that...
     
    MusicMiles likes this.
  6. Peter McDermott

    Peter McDermott pfm Member

    Hi Weekender, yes that makes sense. With vinyl back in popularity some releases are not coming out on CD: Boygenius for example and my copy was warped but bought on-line so too much hassle to send back, though it does play ok.
     
  7. mercalia

    mercalia pfm Member

    no. does any one one make records using master tapes any longer, then maybe. If it started as digital dont see the point
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2019
  8. Woodface

    Woodface pfm Member

    New vinyl is generally a con, the prices are ridiculous. I tend to buy new releases on CD & pick up the odd bit of vinyl 2nd hand. It is the music that counts rather than the format. Also, coloured vinyl does generally sound shit.
     
    leroyd likes this.
  9. Peter McDermott

    Peter McDermott pfm Member

    That's my feeling too but I wonder if in some cases "old tech" is used for some releases.

    Cost is a big issues, in some cases £25 to £30.
     
  10. Dougie2404

    Dougie2404 pfm Member

    Woodface, a bit sweeping that , you've got to remember that vinyl is clear to start with and carbon ( I believe ) is added to make it black so it's coloured too.
     
    andy831 likes this.
  11. Woodface

    Woodface pfm Member

    It may well be a sweeping statement but I do believe there is some truth in it. Struggling to recall many audiophile pressings that are not heavyweight black vinyl? Anyway, if you can't make a sweeping statement on forum then there really is not point in it;)
     
    Dougie2404 likes this.
  12. matt j

    matt j pfm Member

    I have some very nice sounding modern releases, I think it's as it always was in that some are better than others.
     
    MusicMiles likes this.
  13. MusicMiles

    MusicMiles Active Member

    Carbon Black is there for a purpose as it improves durability where as pink pigment has no value.
     
  14. Woodface

    Woodface pfm Member

    Aah, thought so
     
  15. daytona600

    daytona600 Registered User

    Carbon Black followed on from Shellac discs as Norm

    1850s
    Frenchman Édouard-Léon Scott de Martinville uses the phonautogram to record the human voice by tracing sound waves on smoke-blackened paper or glass. The resulting tracings could not be played back at the time, but in 2008 several tracings from 1860 were processed as digital audio files and successfully played back (1853)

    1870s
    Thomas Alva Edison succeeds in recording and playing back ‘Mary had a little lamb’ on the first phonograph using tinfoil wrapped around a cylinder. He receives a patent in 1878 for recording on tinfoil (1877)

    Organette disc (late 1870s – 1920s)

    1880s
    Piano roll (1883 – 2008)

    Music box disc (1886 – )

    Bell and Tainter are granted a patent for their graphophone, which uses wax-coated cardboard tubes instead of tinfoil, and engraves the sound waves instead of embossing them (1886)

    Organ cobs (late 1880s – late 1920s)

    Graphophone / Dictaphone cylinder (1887 – early 1950s)

    Emile Berliner is granted a patent for gramophone discs (1887)

    Edison introduces his ‘Perfected Phonograph’ using all-wax cylinders (1888)

    Brown wax cylinder (late 1880s to 1906)

    Ediphone (1888 – early 1950s)

    Berliner’s first gramophone discs (of 5 inches diameter) are marketed in Europe (1889)

    Pre-recorded wax cylinders are first marketed, initially for use in nickel-in-the-slot machines (early juke boxes) (1889)

    1890s
    Berliner Gramophone begins marketing 7-inch discs in the United States (1894)

    Pathé cylinder (1894 – 1914)

    Valdemar Poulsen is granted a patent for wire recording (1898 – 1960s)

    Wire recording (1898 – 1960s)

    Multiple groove phonograph record (1898 – )

    1900s
    10-inch 78 rpm record (1901 – 1960)

    Edison Records introduces the improved Gold Moulded Record cylinder, made of a harder wax capable of being played hundreds of times, and making manufacture easier as cylinders could now be moulded from a master (1902)

    Gold-Moulded Records (1902 – 1912)

    The 12-inch 78 rpm phonograph disc is introduced, offering increased playing time of 4 or 5 minutes per side. Despite this, it is never as popular as the 10-inch version (1903)

    12-inch 78 rpm record (1903 – mid 1950s)

    The Bell and Tainter patent on wax cylinder records expire, opening up the market to competition (1903)

    Gramophone postcard (1903 – 1970s)

    Sterling Record (1904 – 1908)

    Pathé vertical-cut disc record (1905 – 1932)

    Centre-start phonograph record (1905 – )

    The Columbia Phonograph Company introduces the semi-flexible Marconi Velvet Tone Record, but it is a commercial failure and withdrawn in 1908 (1907)

    Marconi Velvet Tone Record (1907 – 1908)

    Indestructible Record (1907 – 1922)

    Edison Records introduces the Amberol Record cylinder. By doubling the number of grooves to 200 threads per inch, playing time is increased to 4 minutes (1908)

    Amberol Records (1908 – 1912)

    Record album (late 1900s – 1950s)

    1910s
    Most disc records are now recorded at between 78 – 80 rpm. The speed of earlier discs varied greatly, and could be anywhere between 60 and 130 rpm (1910)

    Around this time, record ‘albums’ become available for listeners to store multiple discs, and later become popular as a way for record companies to package multiple discs by a single performer or type of music (1910)

    Edison Disc Record / Diamond Disc (1912 – 1929)

    Blue Amberol Records (1912 – 1929)

    Edison begins his ‘Tone Tests’, with the first one taking place at Carnegie Hall, New York. The audience is asked to guess between the live voice of Marie Rappold of the Metropolitan Opera, and an Edison Diamond Disc (1916)

    The basic patents for the manufacture of laterally-cut disc records expired, opening the field for countless companies to produce 78 rpm records (1919)

    1920s
    Record sales hit a peak in the pre-radio age US of $105.6 million, before declining to just $5.5 million in 1933 (1921)

    Little Briton records (early 1920s)

    The Bell records (1921 – 1926)

    Little Marvel (1921 – 1928)

    Mimosa records (1921 – 1928)

    Kiddyphone record (1920s)

    Pygmy Gramophone (1923 – 1925)

    Victor and Columbia begin issuing electrically recorded 78 rpm phonograph discs (1925)

    Picture discs (1920s – )

    Dixy records (1926)

    8-inch 78rpm record (late 1920s – mid 1930s)

    Acetate / lacquer disc (late 1920s – )

    Electrical Transcription Disc (late 1920s – 1980s)

    Victory records (1928 – 1931)

    Broadcast Twelve (1928 – 1934)

    Edison Records, the last company to make phonograph cylinders, ceases production of Blue Amberol Records, the last type of cylinder. Edison Diamond Discs also cease production as Edison Records closes (1929)

    8-inch 78 rpm records briefly become popular in the UK (1929)

    1930s
    Filmophone Flexible Record (1930 – 1932)

    Kid Kord (1930s)

    Voice Record (1930s – early 1940s)

    Professional open reel tape (NAB reel) (1930s – )

    Pathé vertical-cut records cease being produced in France (1932)

    Durium record (1932 – 1933)

    AEG demonstrates the first tape recorder at the Berlin Radio Show (1935)

    Crown records (1935 – 1937)

    In the US, Billboard magazine publishes its first music hit parade (1936)

    1940s
    Voice-O-Graph (1940 – 1960s)

    Cardboard record (1940s – 1980s)

    SoundScriber (1942 – 1960s)

    V-Disc (1943 – 1949)

    In Germany, AEG develops stereo tape recording (1943)

    Jack Mullin sends two Magnetophon tape decks to the US and demonstrates them at the Institute of Radio Engineers (IRE) meeting in San Francisco (1946)

    Audograph (1946 – 1976)

    Sales of 78 rpm records hit their peak in the US (1947)

    Dictabelt (1947 – 1980)

    Voicewriter (late 1940s – 1960s)

    Recordon (1948 – mid 1950s)

    Soundmirror (1948 – 1954)

    Columbia records introduces the 33⅓ rpm 12-inch and 10-inch microgroove long-play record (1948)

    10-inch LP (1948 – 1980s)

    12-inch LP (1948 – )

    White label vinyl record (1948 – )

    Pre-recorded open reel tapes become available in the US, reaching the UK in 1952 (1949)

    ¼-inch open reel tape (1949 – 1980s)

    Coloured vinyl record (1949 – )

    RCA introduces the 7-inch microgroove 45 rpm record and the ‘battle of the speeds’ ensues (1949)

    7-inch single (1949 – )

    1950s
    Tefifon (1950 – 1960s)

    SoundScriber tape (1950s – 1980s)

    Flexi-disk (1950s – )

    16⅔ rpm LP (Long Play) 12 inch record (early 1950 – early 1970s)

    Minifon wire reel (1951 – 1967)

    Cook Binaural record (1952 – 1958)

    The 7-inch EP record is launched, sitting between the 7-inch single and the 12-inch LP (1952)

    7-inch EP (1952 – )

    In the UK, a record chart for sales of singles begins, initially with just the top 15 (1952)

    Pye magnetic disc (1953 – late 1950s)

    Seeburg Background Music Library (1954 – 1960s)

    Grundig Stenorette (1954 – 1970s)

    Mohawk Midgetape (1955 – early 1960s)

    Chrysler starts putting Highway Hi-Fi players in its cars in an attempt to allow drivers their choice of music other than the radio, but the system is abandoned in 1959 (1956)

    Highway Hi-Fi (1956 – 1959)

    The first commercial stereophonic LPs are released (1957)

    Unit sales of 78 rpm records reach a peak of 54.1 million, before quickly declining (1957)

    Stereophonic LP (Long Play) 12 inch record (1957 – )

    Dictaphone Dictet (1957 – early 1960s)

    Philips EL 3581 (1958 – early 1960s)

    RCA introduces the Sound Tape Cartridge, offering the sound quality of stereo open-reel tape, but in a much more convenient pre-threaded form. It lasts until 1964 (1958)

    RCA Sound Tape Cartridge (1958-1964)

    Garrard Magazine tape (1959 – early 1960s)

    Minifon tape (1959 – 1967)

    35mm magnetic film for audio production (1959 – 1970)

    Seeburg Background Music System (1959 – 1986)

    Fidelipac (1959 – late 1990s)

    1960s
    The last 10-inch 78 rpm record is released in the UK (‘A Mess Of Blues’ by Elvis Presley) (1960)

    Gala Goldentone (1960 – 1964)

    Magnabelt (1961 – 1972)

    Little LP (1961 – 1975)

    Revere stereo tape cartridge (1962 – mid 1960s)

    Echo-matic II (1962 – early 1970s)

    The 4-track (Stereo-Pak) endless-loop cartridge is introduced, and players for the car and home are available. It is successful until the later 8-Track cartridge becomes more popular despite its lower quality (1962)

    4-track (Stereo-Pak) (1962 – 1970)

    BASF Tape Letter (early 1960s – early 1970s)

    Scotch One Five Special (1960s)

    EMI Voice Letter (1960s)

    Philips introduces the Compact Cassette (1963)

    Compact Cassette (1963 – 2000s)

    Philips EL 3583 (1963 – early 1970s)

    Grundig EN3 (1964 – 1970s)

    The 8-Track (Stereo 8) cartridge is introduced, and wins out over 4-Track cartridges by 1970 (1964)

    8-Track (Stereo 8) (1964 – 1988)

    Rediffusion Reditune (1960s – 1980s)

    Philips agrees to freely license the Compact Cassette design, to secure support for the format from Sony (1965)

    Memocord (1965 – mid 1970s)

    3M Cantata 700 (1965 – 1990s)

    The Philips Record Company makes pre-recorded music cassettes available in Europe (1965)

    Music cassette (Musicassette) (1965 – 2003)

    The 2-track endless-loop PlayTape cartridge is introduced. It was very successful as a portable music format, but is discontinued in 1970 (1966)

    PlayTape (1966 – 1970)

    Mail Call Letterpack (late 1960s)

    Hip-Pocket Record (1967 – 1969)

    Mini-Cassette (1967 -)

    Major record labels stop producing monophonic LPs (1968)

    Quadraphonic open reel tape (Q4) is introduced, followed later by various quadraphonic LP formats, and Q8 cartridges. Quadraphonic formats die out by the end of the 1970s (1969)

    Sound-A-Round Talking Puzzle (1969 – early 1970s)

    Quadraphonic open reel tape (Q4) (1969 – mid 1970s)

    Endless loop Compact Cassette (1969 – 1990s)

    Microcassette (1969 -)

    1970s
    Trimicron LP (early 1970s – mid 1970s)

    Aristocart (early 1970s – late 1990s)

    8⅓ rpm flexi-discs (early 1970s – 2001)

    Philips Background Music Services cartridge (1970s – 1980s)

    EV Stereo-4 (1970 – 1975)

    Quadraphonic 8-Track (Q8) (1970 – 1978)

    DuPont introduces chromium dioxide (Type II) compact cassette tape (1970)

    Compact Cassette Type II (Chrome / High Bias) (1970 – 2000s)

    Steno-Cassette (1971 – )

    SQ Quadraphonic (1971 – 1979)

    Dynaflex (1971 – late 1970s)

    Music Box Record Player (1971 – 1990s)

    Denon releases the first digitally recorded commercial LP (Nippon Columbia NCC-8501, Mozart: String Quartets K. 458 and K. 421 by the Smetana Quartet.) using PCM encoding on open reel video tape (1972)

    Quadraphonic Sound (QS) (1972 – 1978)

    CD-4 (Compatible Discrete 4) / Quadradisc (1972 – 1979)

    Audiopak (1972 – 1990s)

    10-inch single (1970s – )

    12-inch singles begin to appear, allowing a wider dynamic range than 7-inch singles (1973)

    12-inch single (1973 – )

    Compact Cassette Type III (Ferro-chrome) (mid 1970s – early 1980s)

    Gray Manufacturing Company ceases production of Audograph dictation discs (1976)

    Elcaset (1976 – 1980)

    Sales of 8-Track cartridges reach a peak of 133.6 million units in the US, and decline quickly after that, effectively disappearing by 1983 (1978)

    IEC (International Electro-Technical Commission) approves the type I,II,III and IV classification for Compact Cassettes (1978)

    Luminous vinyl record (1978 – )

    Sony introduces the portable Walkman cassette player in Japan (reaching the US and UK in 1980) (1979)

    dbx disc (1979 – 1982)

    Notches for automatic cassette tape type recognition are introduced (1979)

    Compact Cassette Type IV (Metal) (1979 – late 1990s)

    1980s
    Sony abandons the Elcaset system, and sells off remaining stock in Finland (1980)

    Dictaphone ceases production of Dictabelt (1980)

    The so-called ‘Red Book’ standard for Compact Disc Digital Audio published jointly by Philips and Sony (1980)

    Laser-etched vinyl (1980 – )

    5-inch picture disc single (1980s)

    Shaped 7-inch single (1980s -)

    Cassette single (Cassingle) (1980 – early 2000s)

    1+1 music cassette (early 1980s)

    Metal tape Microcassette (1981 – mid-1980s)

    The Compact Disc is launched in Japan, reaching the US and Europe in 1983 (1982)

    Yamaha Playcard (1982 – mid 1980s)

    DASH (Digital Audio Stationary Head) (1982 – mid-1990s)

    Casio ROM Pack (1983 – early 1990s)

    Compact Disc (1983 -)

    Bandai micro cartridge (mid 1980s)

    The Dire Straits’ album ‘Brothers in Arms’ sells more copies on Compact Disc than on LP, and became the first Compact Disc to surpass the one million sales mark (1985)

    Billboard in the US begins a separate chart for 12-inch single sales (1985)

    CD single (1985 – )

    Picocassette (1985 – late 1980s)

    Scotchcart / Scotchcart II (mid 1980s – late 1990s)

    The last discs for the Seeburg Background Music System are sent out (1986)

    Compact LaserDisc (1986)

    CD+G (CD+Graphics) (1986 – )

    Digital Audio Tape (DAT) is launched by Sony, but fails to make an impact in the consumer market (1987)

    Double-duration Compact Disc (1987 – 1988)

    Digital Audio Tape (DAT) (1987 – 2005)

    Cassette singles (cassingles) begin to be more widely distributed, reaching a sales peak in the US in 1990 of 87 million units, before disappearing in the early 2000s (1987)

    Sales of Compact Discs overtake those of the 12-inch LP (1988)

    Sales of Compact Cassettes reach a peak in the US of 450 million units (1988)

    Fleetwood Mac’s Greatest Hits becomes the last commercial 8-Track released by a major record label (1988)

    CD Video (1988 – 1992)

    Pocket Rockers (1988 – 1991)

    Mini CD single (1988 – early 1990s)

    CD-BGM (1989 – late 2000s)

    Roland Music Style Card (1989 – 1991)

    1990s
    Radio Shack stops selling blank 8-Track tapes (1990)

    Minimax Compact Disc (1990s – )

    9-inch single (1990 – 2007)

    Holographic Compact Disc (1991 – 1996)

    CD-i Ready (1991 – 1998)

    QSound Compact Disc (1991 – 2001)

    Compact Cassette sales begin to fall from their worldwide peak of 1,552 million units, and Compact Disc sales finally overtake them (1992)

    The Audio Home Recording Act in the US imposes taxes on recordable audio media (such as DAT tape) and introduces a Serial Copy Management System. Other countries also introduce levies on recordable media (1992)

    NT (1992 – late 1990s)

    Philips launch the Digital Compact Cassette as a possible replacement for the analogue Compact Cassette, but it only lasts until 1996 (1992)

    Digital Compact Cassette (1992 – 1996)

    ADAT (Alesis Digital Audio Tape) (1992 – 2003)

    MiniDisc (1992 – 2013)

    Compact Disc-Recordable (CD-R) (1992 – )

    DTRS (Digital Tape Recording System) (1993 – 2012)

    The first MP3 encoder is made available (1994)

    Record companies begin adding multimedia content to Compact Discs to create what became known as Enhanced CDs (1994)

    Enhanced CD (1994 – )

    Yamaha Music Cartridge (1995 – late 1990s)

    High Definition Compatible Digital (HDCD) (1995 – )

    XRCD (1995 – )

    Pioneer introduces a consumer CD-R burner. As a computer device, blank media is exempt from the levies imposed under the 1992 Audio Home Recording Act in the US, and there is no digital rights management (1996)

    The first pirated MP3 track (Metallica’s ‘Until it Sleeps’) appears on the internet (1996)

    Shaped Compact Disc (1996 – )

    Compact Disc audio recorders become available (1997)

    DTS 5.1 Music Disc (1997 – early 2000s)

    Compact Disc Digital Audio Recordable (CD-R Audio) (1997 – 2010s)

    Sales of Compact Disc singles begin to decline in the US (1997)

    Sony declares 1998 to be ‘The Year of the MiniDisc‘ and launches a big marketing campaign (1998)

    VinylVideo (1998 – 2003, 2018 – )

    Napster is launched, enabling easy sharing of MP3 files (1999)

    Yaboom Box (1999 – 2001)

    Yaboom MCD Musical Key Chain (1999 – 2001)

    HitClips (1999 – 2002)

    Sony and Philips launch the Super Audio CD (SACD) as a possible successor to the Compact Disc but it makes little impact (1999)

    Super Audio CD (SACD) (1999 – )

    2000s
    Compact Disc sales peak in US at 942.5 million units, and decline each year after (2000)

    Copy-protected Compact Disc (2000 – 2006)

    DVD-Audio (2000 -)

    Apple launches the iPod (2001)

    Timecode vinyl (2001 – )

    e-kara Karaoke Cartridge (2001 – 2009)

    VJ Starz Video Karaoke Machine (2002 – mid 2000s)

    DataPlay (2002 – mid 2000s)

    Record labels agreed to licence music to Apple to sell, and the iTunes Store is launched (2003)

    Most major US music companies discontinue sales of pre-recorded Compact Cassettes, and only 17.2 million are sold in the US (down from a peak of 450.1 million in the US in 1988) (2003)

    HitClips Disc (2003 – 2004)

    Compact Disc sales peak in the UK at 162.4 million units, and decline each year afterwards (2004)

    Hi-MD (2004 – 2011)

    Sony stops production of Digital Audio Tape (DAT) recorders (2005)

    DualDisc (2005 – 2009)

    The first music on USB memory sticks is launched in the UK (2006)

    USB flash drive (2006 – )

    Some albums are sold on microSD memory cards. Some are on generic cards, and later others under brands such as Gruvi, slotMusic and MQS (2007)

    microSD card (2007 – late 2000s)

    Super High Material CD (2007 – )

    Tooth Tunes (2007 – )

    VinylDisc (2007 – )

    Mass production of piano rolls ends as MIDI files replace them in player pianos (2008)

    Spotify is launched (2008)

    slotMusic (2008 – 2012)

    Blu-spec CD (2008 – )

    2010s
    Sony ceases selling the cassette Walkman in Japan (2010)

    The term ‘cassette tape‘ is removed from the Oxford English Dictionary (2011)

    McDonald’s Happy Meal music player (2011)

    Playbutton (2011 – )

    Sony ends shipments of MiniDisc systems (2013)

    High Fidelity Pure Audio (2013 – )

    MQS (Mastering Quality Sound) (2013 – )

    UHQCD (Ultimate High Quality Compact Disc) (2015 – )

    MQA Compact Disc (2017 – )

    Hi-Res CD (2018 – )
     
  16. Paul Mc

    Paul Mc pfm Member

    Thanks - not.
     
    MusicMiles likes this.
  17. Woodface

    Woodface pfm Member

    Well, it was a full answer to a question not actually asked?
     
  18. Peter McDermott

    Peter McDermott pfm Member

    Thanks Daytona600.

    Myself and a friend were hitching around Europe in 1983 and on of our lifts took us back to his flat just to show us his compact disc player.
     
  19. Paul Mc

    Paul Mc pfm Member

    I don't think so.
     
  20. manicatel

    manicatel pfm Member

    Just bought a reissue ( seriously bright blue!) version of the Little Village eponymous album. Sounds superb.
    Goes to show that as with many things, there are good & bad reissues. Such is life.
     
    MusicMiles likes this.

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