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Labour at it again... anti-Semitism... #II

Discussion in 'off topic' started by Stunsworth, Jul 7, 2019.

  1. jackbarron

    jackbarron Chelsea, London

    Mmm. Hopefully Panorama's investigation into Labour and anti-Semitism will be focused and to the point.

    I don't have that much time for the BBC anymore, when it comes to journalism, especially after the Jimmy Savile debacle. If I want to know the news worldwide, I watch Al Jazeera. Their reports are often in depth and appear quite balanced.

    Can easily believe some people at the Beeb have it in for Corbyn. Journalists and management there have close links with both the Tories and Labour.

    As mentioned above Lizzie Watson, Margaret Hodge's daughter, is an editor for the BBC News programmes, according to what I've read elsewhere online.

    Whether tonight's Panorama investigation is good, bad or indifferent, some parts of the Labour Party will complain as much as they can.

    What I am interested in is why Labour can't deal with anti-Semites quickly. Keir Starmer said today that "he wants to see Labour’s rulebook changed so that in a clear case of antisemitism a member is automatically expelled." https://www.theguardian.com/news/20...clusion-rule-antisemitism-keir-starmer-denial

    Makes sense to me.

    Jack

    [​IMG]
     
  2. Still

    Still he said his naim was ralph

  3. Tim Jones

    Tim Jones pfm Member

    Beautiful, and classic, combination of the ad hom and the what-aboutery.

    Having dealt with him over many years, John Ware is a thoroughly good investigative journalist, and (depressingly) one of the last functioning ones we have.
     
  4. Seanm

    Seanm pfm Member

    No qualifications there at all? The blatant partisanship and Islamophobia - not worth mentioning? Smears?
     
  5. Tim Jones

    Tim Jones pfm Member

    Have you had that irony transplant yet Sean?
     
  6. Seanm

    Seanm pfm Member

    I guess not, since I'm honestly scratching my head head at that one. Ware made a program for which the BBC had to apologise for racism and pay damages: I don't recall heaping praise on anyone with that on their CV.
     
    Enfield boy and ff1d1l like this.
  7. Still

    Still he said his naim was ralph

    jackbarron likes this.
  8. Tim Jones

    Tim Jones pfm Member

    It is one of the most depressing,infantile and increasingly Trumpian aspects of our broken public culture that hacks who report what (many) other people say, or stuff that happens, are either smeared or undermined.

    I'm sure that there is significant Islamophobia - even rampant racism - in the Conservative Party. That does not make Labour's partly self-inflicted anti-Semitic issue any the better.
     
    poppop, Woodface, Still and 1 other person like this.
  9. Brian

    Brian Eating fat, staying slim

    Quite.

    It would be useful if this John Ware bloke, or anyone else at the BBC for that matter, devoted even 10% of the time it spends smearing Labour on reporting the truth about the Tory party.

    Not much decent investigative journalism at the BBC these days.

    These people should work honestly for their money, after all, they exist on a guaranteed handout by the tax payer.
     
    Enfield boy and ks.234 like this.
  10. jackbarron

    jackbarron Chelsea, London

    Had you seen Ware's Is Labour Anti-Semitic programme when you posted the above?

    Jack
     
  11. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    I agree it was slanted and the vile racism that has always been at the very core of the Conservative Party right back into slavery days, through Enoch Powell and the whole “Want a n****** for a neighbour? Vote Labour!” campaign and still perfectly visible today in Windrush, May’s ‘Go Home’ vans, Grenfell, Baroness Wasi’s many complaints of Islamophobia etc etc largely receives a blind eye from the media, but that does not make placing Labour’s clear racism problem under a bright spotlight wrong. I don’t know enough about the situation to know exactly where the truth lies, but I’d be pretty amazed if anything the BBC produced tonight was actually incorrect. The portrayal was certainly of a party I’d not go anywhere near as an employee and have absolutely no intention whatsoever of voting for. The two main parties can go to hell as far as I’m concerned. Ugly obsolete junk the pair of them.
     
    bob atherton, Still and poppop like this.
  12. Seanm

    Seanm pfm Member

    Well sure, can't argue with the second point: in fact the reporter's own well-documented history of Islamophobic program-making is a separate issue from the antisemitism he's reporting on (although not irrelevant to the reporting itself). It's just interesting, isn't it, what kind of racism it seems you don't have to apologise for, or even mention in the course of singing a journalist's praises: it's just not an issue. Making it an issue, even mentioning it, in fact constitutes a smear.

    *Ding!* Aha! my irony transplant finally seems to have taken!

    Look, I spend a lot of my time defending hacks and defending the BBC in particular. But they have a massive problem when it comes to self-criticism, and the alacrity with which they squeal "Trumpian!" the moment anyone points out very obvious problems with bias and racism is testimony to that.
     
  13. Enfield boy

    Enfield boy pfm Member

    You'd be amazed? Bloody hell Tony, all the air time they give to Farage, Oakshitt etc, all the shell suited Britain Fist types they ship in for QT, all the soft Marr /Kvntsberk and that deputy political editor shouty tw@t they have on?!

    Bring back Clegg, resurrect Cable.... God, give me strength.
     
  14. Cav

    Cav pfm Member

    You have been told countless times about Labour Party procedures. The "Rulebook"can be changed, subject to due process, so that a member against whom there is a clear case of anti-semitism, subject to due process, is automatically expelled. What you and he (presumably) wants is for it to happem more quickly.

    As to your interest, that is only to with your ant-Labour pathology....
     
  15. Seanm

    Seanm pfm Member

    I didn't watch it, but I saw the BBC News report on it. I won't comment on the substance of it. But context really does matter: I'm not denying there's a problem with antisemitism in the Labour Party, but the question is, is the media's treatment of it proportionate to the scale of the problem? If not, what are the consequences? Personally I think the consequences are just awful all round but especially awful for antiracist struggle. The solution within the Labour Party is not a mass purge, IMO, but education, and creating a situation in which people feel they're being unfairly attacked, or ignored (many BAME members are angry that there is a clear hierarchy of racism being put in place here) is not one in which that's likely to happen. Secondly it very obviously serves the far right: we've got to a point where sensible progressive people are throwing up their hands and saying, "There all as bad as each other!" Just look back at the racist stuff that the Tories have done just in the last year, the last week, and ask, whose interests does that actually serve?
     
  16. hermit

    hermit pfm Member

    I was shocked by the revelation tonight that after 3 years there have only been 15 expulsions relating to anti-semitism. That statistic alone does seem to suggest there may well be a problem with institutionalised racism within the party. It will be instructive to see what the The Equality and Human Rights Commission investigation concludes.
     
  17. sq225917

    sq225917 situation engineer

    Or it shows that the problem is blown out of all proportion. Or amounts of either are true.
     
  18. richgilb

    richgilb Admonishtrator

    I fell alseep during it after hmm 10 minutes. It was not that interesting at all. And 10 minutes in, they had not outed one racist person, accused of making racist comments. Loads of people complaining /crying on a general level, but nobody mentioning names. Did it heat up after I fell asleep? There is more general stuff on R4 this morning with accusations of people smoothing the problem over, but still no people named and shamed for specific incidents, so I assume there are none?
     
  19. TheDecameron

    TheDecameron Unicorns fart glitter.

    I marvel at the amount of media attention directed toward it compared with the political crisis Britain is in and religious bigotry and racism in other organisations.
     
    kendo, ff1d1l and Sue Pertwee-Tyr like this.
  20. richgilb

    richgilb Admonishtrator

    To be fair, Brexit takes up too much space too. However, today I am wondering why Boris has not resigned along with Kim.
     

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