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Oh Britain, what have you done (part ∞+11)?

Discussion in 'off topic' started by Colin L, Dec 8, 2018.

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  1. matthewr

    matthewr spɹɐʍʞɔɐq spɹoɔǝɹ ɹnoʎ sʎɐld

    Now I am even more confused because a) that means Labour's silence is partly to blame (which is the point many have been making) and b) basically, you have given up!

    A strong opposition would be making a case that we must avoid No Deal or May Deal at all costs. It is certainly not to late for a cross party national movement to take down May's government and avoid disaster in March.
     
  2. Ragaman

    Ragaman Mentalist

    What could they have done, her party decided to keep her, little anyone else could have done.
     
  3. ff1d1l

    ff1d1l pfm Member

    Fantasy or not, whatever the result needs it as the original ref was democratically flawed and has no legitimacy.
     
  4. Ragaman

    Ragaman Mentalist

    So why isn't this happening & how do they go about this.
    I havn't given up, just facing the reality of the situation.

    I would say a cross party national movement is a bit of a stretch considering our political history.
     
  5. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    Also worth repeating that the key aspects of being an opposition party is both opposing and producing a credible counter-argument. Labour simply are not doing this with their attempts to face all ways at once and spouting magic unicorn gibberish.
     
  6. matthewr

    matthewr spɹɐʍʞɔɐq spɹoɔǝɹ ɹnoʎ sʎɐld

    I don't pretend it's easy, but there are many ways to move forward. Maintaining a sort of gnomic silence in the face of a national crisis would be about 137th on my list of possible approaches.
     
    jtrade, farfromthesun, NeilR and 3 others like this.
  7. Seeker_UK

    Seeker_UK Waiting for the streetcar..

    How about a motion of no confidence when numerous MPs stood up saying they'd support one?
     
  8. Ragaman

    Ragaman Mentalist

    Would you accept a no deal result, which is a very realistic proposition.
     
  9. Sue Pertwee-Tyr

    Sue Pertwee-Tyr pfm Member

    There won't be a GE before Brexit happens, so what's the plan? How are we even supposed to vote for Labour, assuming for the moment we might be persuaded to hold our noses and do so to prevent the Tories getting in again because a post-Brexit Tory government would just be too awful to contemplate.

    Or is that the plan?
     
  10. Ragaman

    Ragaman Mentalist

    What happened? May is still here, her deal is still here until the end of January, how can she get away with stalling this way, surely if parliament could stop this transparent tactic they would.
     
  11. ff1d1l

    ff1d1l pfm Member

    With known outcomes on the table instead of fairy dust, and no Aaron Banks/Putin interference, if it went that way I'd accept it.
     
  12. TheDecameron

    TheDecameron Unicorns fart glitter.

    And you voted for it, me ol’ darlin. You’ll be surprised how few escape the damage from it.
     
    jackbarron, Nick_G and wyjsar like this.
  13. Stunsworth

    Stunsworth pfm Member

    Labour’s plan seems to be do nothing and wait for the Tories to implode. They may well implode, but what they’re not going to do is bring the government down and force an election. Neither are the DUP going to vote against the Tories and risk a Labour government - despite the evidence that DUP -voters- are nervous about a no deal Brexit.

    So, given that the EU have vetoed May’s plan, the least worst option I can see is that the negotiations are extended beyond the end of March, but that’s only kicking a well kicked can further down the road.
     
  14. matthewr

    matthewr spɹɐʍʞɔɐq spɹoɔǝɹ ɹnoʎ sʎɐld

    Well, in a word, Corbyn. If he had, you know, an actual policy then some movement on a cross party deal and a no confidence vote could easily lead to movement. We know there are people on the Tory side (Grieve, Sourby, Liddington, Clarke, etc) that are every bit as exasperated as the rest of us and would act in the national interest if the situation were handled skillfully.
     
  15. Ragaman

    Ragaman Mentalist

    Unless, as Mathew indicates, parliament stand up in unison, we are heading for a May no deal, her deal will be rejected, there will be no ref,will be no ending of Brexit under May,then of course, come the next election, many here are proposing a protest vote against Corbyn's Labour, could not make this up.
     
  16. Ragaman

    Ragaman Mentalist

    What would this Corbyn policy be, I can guess but humour me.
     
  17. Stunsworth

    Stunsworth pfm Member

    The problem with that is that it implies that the only role of an opposition is to sit on their hands until their next election.
     
    Sue Pertwee-Tyr likes this.
  18. Ragaman

    Ragaman Mentalist

    Yup, all down to me is Brexit,line up, line up, bring yer pitchforks, or maybe cancel my vote & Brexit goes away.
     
  19. matthewr

    matthewr spɹɐʍʞɔɐq spɹoɔǝɹ ɹnoʎ sʎɐld

    Whatever he thinks is best for the country. Which is, well, his job.
     
  20. notaclue

    notaclue pfm Member

    That is their plan of action to bring down the government.

    They don't have a Brexit plan beyond this https://labour.org.uk/manifesto/negotiating-brexit/

    An umpty-hundred-page PDF file setting out their Brexit plan in forensic detail? Nope. Fraid not. That is nowhere to be seen on their website. You'll have to be content with this from Mr Corbyn: "There will be some who will tell you that Brexit is a disaster for this country and some who will tell you that Brexit will create a land of milk and honey. The truth is that it’s in our hands: Brexit is what we make of it together."

    I do wonder whether their lack of realistic Brexit plan might have an impact on just how keen they are to implement their plan on brining down the government (even if it may well not work). Do Labour really want to be the ones who take over just in time to f**k-up Brexit and thus the economy?
     
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