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Remainers for No Deal

Discussion in 'off topic' started by Seanm, Aug 10, 2019.

  1. jackbarron

    jackbarron Chelsea, London

    Where has Corbyn said if he leads a caretaker government he will organise a General Election and a referendum?

    What Labour have stated is they won't form a unity government or do a deal with the SNP and Lib Dems. McDonnell made noises about a caretaker government, a GE and a referendum, at an Edinburgh festival fringe event last week. He hasn't said that Remain would be on the ballot.

    Please show us where Corbyn has said if he negotiates a Labour Brexit deal, i.e. a soft Brexit, it will be put up against Remain in a referendum or confirmatory vote. He hasn't.

    This is more of the ongoing Labour con trick to try and get their version of Brexit through, instead of looking after the best interests of the UK. In many ways they are as slippery as Johnson, Cummings and the ERG.

    Polly Toynbee meanwhile argues Only a government of national unity can deliver us from no deal https://www.theguardian.com/comment...nal-unity-no-deal-margaret-beckett-referendum

    Jack
     
  2. Brian

    Brian Eating fat, staying slim

    You said...
    Channel 4 reported that if Labour got into power it would negotiate a Brexit Deal, hold a Referendum and campaign to Remain. I mean how stupid can you get?
    https://www.pinkfishmedia.net/forum/threads/how-long-before-a-vote-of-no-confidence-in-johnson-government.230243/page-9#post-3726719

    When questioned on this, you then said...

    “Channel 4 were obviously wrong in their conjecture. You obviously have a problem understanding this, because you're a troll or perhaps thick.
    Show me a speech where Corbyn says there will be a second referendum, with Remain as a choice, if Labour get into power and negotiate a Brexit deal.”
    https://www.pinkfishmedia.net/forum/threads/labour-at-it-again-anti-semitism-ii.229866/page-58#post-3733054

    And here you are today, demanding again you be shown a quote from Labour to something you have declared as stupid. These earlier posts, along with your latest suggests that if Labour does what you’re demanding you will again accuse the party of stupidity.

    Why are you demanding Labour commit to this?
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2019
  3. SteveS1

    SteveS1 I heard that, pardon?

    If the unelected Dominic Cummings strutting around the HoC doesn't provoke the kind of MP rebellion that is required for a GE/Confirmatory vote on specific options - nothing will.
     
  4. TheDecameron

    TheDecameron Unicorns fart glitter.

    He’s in and out of No.10 like a weasel in a rabbit’s hole.
     
  5. Still

    Still he said his naim was ralph

    If LP were to elect a woman leader, and subsequently form a government, would you consider a statue of Labours' 1st woman pm appropriate?

    No doubt Jews, and the EHRC, will be most comforted to hear about LPs institutional equality.

    Women in politics: Men on the left are sexist. Labour needs to do more to fix it.
    Plenty of women have contributed to the leftist cause, but women’s rights always come second to the male-centric populism of their cohorts.


    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/aug/14/men-on-left-sexist-labour-womens-rights

    Considering 51% of the population are women I'll file this twuntery under doesn't bode well for LP election prospects.
    Possibly "for the many not the few" is becoming ironic.
     
  6. ks.234

    ks.234 pfm Member

    My concerns about Jo Swinson have nothing to do with her sex or statues. It has everything to do with her voting record.

    For anyone with centre left sensibilities:
    • She has voted both For and Against laws to promote Equality and Human Rights. 6 votes for, 2 votes against, 3 absences, between 2011–2018
    • For reducing Housing Benefit
    • Against raising Welfare Benefits
    • Against raising benefits for the Disabled
    • For a reduction of Welfare Benefits
    • Against spending on creating jobs for young longterm employed
    • For increases to VAT
    • Against Banker's Bonus Tax
    • For reduction Corporation Tax
    • Against restricting privatisation of Health
    • For more Free Schools
    • For Academy Schools
    • For ending financial support for young students
    • For raising Tuition fees
    • For privation of Royal Mail
    • For restricting Legal Aid
    • For selling state owned Forests
    For those concerned about the environment:
    • Both For and Against measures to control Climate Change
    For those who's priority is Brexit:
    • She has voted against or been absent more often than she has voted for EU integration
    • Against referendum on EU membership
    • Both For and Against Rights of EU nationals to remain
    And if PR is your thing:
    • Generally Against Proportional Representation
    Finally, for our Scottish Friends:
    • Against more power to Scotland...and Wales
    To summarise, Jo Swinson is right wing, ambivalent toward Europe, unsure about climate change, mostly against PR, and she really hates the Scots.

    And she's not sure about the Welsh.
     
    Ragaman and Brian like this.
  7. SteveS1

    SteveS1 I heard that, pardon?

    Not impressed with her record at all. Do you know how many were free votes?
     
    2_dive likes this.
  8. ks.234

    ks.234 pfm Member

  9. ff1d1l

    ff1d1l pfm Member

  10. Brian

    Brian Eating fat, staying slim

    Thought I’d quote this one. It’s interesting, unlike the drivel about statues.

    It’s useful to have clarity on what the ‘progressive’ bit means when people talk about progressive parties. She’s basically a tory/right wing extremist leading the LibDems.

     
  11. Still

    Still he said his naim was ralph

    So not a Thatcherite as you previously claimed.
    Thanks for the correction.

    JS was democratically elected leader a bit like Jezza.

    They're not that hard!
     
  12. Schnitger

    Schnitger pfm Member

    What if your MP is Dominic Grieve?
     
  13. ks.234

    ks.234 pfm Member

    I haven’t corrected anything, Swinson’s voting record speaks for itself in supporting the view that she is someone with views closely aligned with traditional Thatcherite values

    You spotted that, well done you
     
    Brian likes this.
  14. TheDecameron

    TheDecameron Unicorns fart glitter.

    The problem Grieve and other Conservative MPs have is not necessarily being unseated by a BP candidate but that their constituency associations have been infiltrated by UKIP and other far right plants with the intention of deselecting them. So they’re fighting a battle on two fronts.
     
  15. Schnitger

    Schnitger pfm Member

    Yes indeed. Grieve is my MP and I've heard of some hard brexiters in the area - friends of a friend - who are centre-left but joined the local Tory party with the intent of deselecting Grieve. My point is that he is probably worth 10 Labour MPs in terms of stopping no deal. Paradoxically, centre leftists are probably better offvoting for aTory like Grieve if they want to stop no deal.

    A problem Grieve has is that he is emotionally and intellectually driven by the consitiution and the procedures that flow from it. He does things by the book. I suspect he's emotionally out of his depth in dealing with a situation that is increasingly driven by a desire to tear up the rule book, whatever the costs. A loose canon like Johnson really is more emotionally suited to that scenario (unfortunately).
     
  16. Ragaman

    Ragaman Mentalist

    She is against Brexit so what does any of this matter to those who are so inclined. She is not even Tory lite as many of her party & followers are, she is a right wing politician borne of everything bad about our current Tory government. I would put Jo Swinson up there with Soubry as the worst example of a current politician & one who, plain & simply because a, she is a woman & b, repels Brexit, has pulled the wool over many an eye, even the so called intelligent bunch.

    Her voting record would put her on the front bench alongside Boris & his cronies & makes May seem almost human.
     
    Brian and ks.234 like this.
  17. Still

    Still he said his naim was ralph

    Yet in the article you referred to JS makes clear she's no fan of Thatcher, let alone a "Thatcherite" as you misrepresented her.
    Presumably born of desperation on your part.

    You appeared to have overlooked it and required a reminder.
    Possibly a case of the wrong sort of democracy.
     
  18. Seanm

    Seanm pfm Member

    Jack: the people speak, the leader listens!

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1161751909788782594?s=21

    Corbyn has written to the other opposition leaders to ask that they support him in a time-limited government formed solely to request an extension to A50 and to call a GE. In the GE Labour to campaign for a public vote with remain on the ballot.

    This is the only way to stop no deal Brexit and it gives remainers everything they’ve been asking for. If the other leaders reject it it’s because they are prioritising narrow party interests over remain. That’s basically all there is to it.
     
  19. TheDecameron

    TheDecameron Unicorns fart glitter.

    He seems to have more positions on a second referendum than the Kama Sutra. I could have sworn I heard a LP member say he now supports a referendum with remain on the paper.
     
  20. Still

    Still he said his naim was ralph

    Lib Dem said "no" on Newsnight because Jeremy Corbyn.
     

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