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Turntable Shelf Material

Discussion in 'audio' started by steveledzep, Oct 11, 2015.

  1. steveledzep

    steveledzep pfm Member

    I have recently changed from a Target 5 tier floor mounted stand with turntable on top, to a wall mounted TT stand. The shelf is unbranded, but very rigid steel framed like Target or Apollo etc.

    I have transferred the 10mm toughened glass shelf to my new wall mounted stand and levelled it on the spikes. Similar installation as before.

    It sounds different, shallow and unforceful not like the TT of before.

    I'm not sure whether glass is suitable, or mdf/chipboard or acrylic shelf might be preferable. Anyone have any experience of what a change may bring ?

    TT is Gyrodec SE / Tabriz / MC Rondo Bronze.

    Thanks.
     
  2. teejjay

    teejjay Fellowship is Life

    I went to a bespoke plastics company for a new shelf for my Target TT wall shelf.
    I got them to cut 18mm corian (black) to replace the shelf. Spaced with my own pads and feet then another 18mm clear perspex shelf, so a 2 tier affair.
    Its deader than my previous shelf. It's supporting a Xerxes 20.
    I didn't spend hours comparing with records, just by nature the support is more solid.
    I was thinking about granite but the acrylics are easier to find cut and deliver. I do have picks but no idea how to post them.
    PM for more info.:cool:
     
  3. Are you in the UK?
    If you are go to your local B&Q store.
    They cut 8 by 4 sheets of MDF to size and get lots of off cuts.
    Ask the chap doing the cutting if he will cut one of the thick ones for you?
    Give him a drink.
    Then go and buy two matt black emulsion paint test pots.
    Job done.
     
  4. James

    James Lord of the Erg\o/s

    Let me get this right. Your TT sounds fabulous on the floor-standing Target atop the very same glass shelf as you tried with your new wall-mounted shelf? If so, that would seem to point the "blame" onto the wall-shelf.

    Is your floor solid concrete and the wall similarly solid brick or concrete? How have you mounted the wall-shelf? If your wall is plasterboard and the wall-shelf fixings don't go into solid timber framing or brick, then you will have a degree of flex that only serves to muddy things.

    More context is required before you "invest" in alternate materials.
     
  5. mikeg

    mikeg pfm Member

    You might want to try the Tiger Paw Vulkan shelves which I believe can be bought separately.

    I have tried the MDF boards from B&Q. I wouldn't recommend them they made my system sound dull and plodding
     
  6. chris@panteg

    chris@panteg pfm Member

    Try bamboo much better than mdf or glass.
     
  7. awkwardbydesign

    awkwardbydesign Officially Awesome

    Is there a worldwide glut of bamboo?
     
  8. James

    James Lord of the Erg\o/s

    It's not the glass.
     
  9. Mike Reed

    Mike Reed pfm Member

    For a suspended t/t on a Target shelf, light and rigid has been found to be better. Definitely not glass. As Barry says above, 12mm MDF is not only rigid and light, but cheap, plentiful and easy to DIY. A further refinement can be made by glueing/countersinking metal discs into the MDF where the spikes go.

    A friend preferred 12 or 18mm acrylic on his with his Orbe, but the MDF route is a cost-effective no-brainer.
     
  10. Shuggie

    Shuggie pfm Member

    Also a much nicer edge finish from bamboo board than with many of the alternatives.
     
  11. abbydog

    abbydog pfm Member

    Don't Panda bears depend on it for food?
     
  12. Mike Reed

    Mike Reed pfm Member

    Bamboo may be the Panda's bread, but it ain't their board.:D
     
  13. F1eng

    F1eng pfm Member

    The subtle amounts of vibration and airborne pickup one gets on a turntable add some extra reverb and apparent timbre to the sound. Moving the TT changes this, sometimes to a subjectively nicer sound sometimes not preferred.
    When I worked at Garrard one of the first things they taught me was how great an effect this was (by getting me to measure it and be amazed by the results).
    Following this I put my own turntable in an adjacent room since I thought back then that I was seeking greater accuracy - higher fidelity to the LP if you will.
    I found the sound bland and unexciting, which was resolved by putting the TT back in the listening room.
    Ever since then I have accepted that part of the enjoyment of LPs is the sound added in multiple ways by resonances and additional-to-the-music-vibration pickup, most of which is euphonic rather than harsh.
    If you preferred the sound on the table I would go back to it (and its location) the likelyhood of getting the same frequency and amplitude combination of effects by changing the wall mount shelf is extremely slight.
     
  14. KeithL

    KeithL pfm Member

    I use 10mm Ciranol which is a trade name for a phenolic resin board. Its density is somewhere between Corian and MDF. It's self coloured black and has a good edge finish.
     
  15. Pete MB&D

    Pete MB&D Pete Maddex, the one and only!

    Glue 4mm MDF to each side of 25mm polystyrene with PVA.

    Stiff light and well damped.

    Pete
     
  16. Klyde

    Klyde pfm Member

    Don't totally discard glass, I'd say. Maybe your Gyro just needs thicker and or harder glass. A Target wall shelf with thin (< 10 mm) glass sounds a lot like the way you describe.

    MDF/wood can easily sound a bit overblown.

    Klyde
     
  17. steveledzep

    steveledzep pfm Member

    Thank you everyone for your replies. I can't work out how to respond to multiple quotes, so I'll have to lump it all in together !

    The 5 tier stand was spike coupled to a solid concrete floor. The wall shelf is solidly screwed into a concrete block wall. The shelf is very rigid, but light. The stand was very heavy as laden with amplifiers etc.

    The response from F1eng has surprised me, seems like I've experienced that change from a small alteration.

    I have an old kitchen cupboard door in the garage which I'll cut to size to try, that will be either chipboard or mdf and will indicate its sonic character.

    The most aesthetically pleasing would be clear acrylic (about £70 bespokely cut) but that's a lot of money for an unknown outcome.

    The polystyrene sandwich sounds interesting, similar to Ikea Lacke ?

    Probably be weekend before I try the kitchen door, I'll report back.
     
  18. Chris

    Chris pfm Member

    Don´t know why I´m saying this but Mana always used 10mm float glass (the cheapest glass around) on its spikes. Anything less than that thickness would seem a bit puny to my guts.
     
  19. Sue Pertwee-Tyr

    Sue Pertwee-Tyr pfm Member

    I wonder whether the change has reduced the amount of feedback in the bass. This feedback can, as F1 might be suggesting, sometimes come across as a rich, deep, beefy bass which is superficially very attractive. But in my experience a leaner, tighter, faster and more tuneful bass makes for a more musically enjoyable experience, once you've acclimatised to the shift in tonal balance.

    You may find that turning the wick up a bit gives you back a bit of the oomph you're missing, perhaps worth a try? If it gets a bit strident, I'd be tempted to look to the glass shelf.

    As to shelves then, IKEA do a bamboo chopping board in a variety of sizes, for very little money. Around £15 IIRC. Perhaps one of those could be cut to size?
     
  20. iansr

    iansr pfm Member

    Panzerholz or Tufnol Whale which has a similar density. Or make a CLD sandwhich with plywood using Green Glue or some othe visco-elastic glue.
     

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