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Winter election III

Discussion in 'off topic' started by Nick_G, Nov 30, 2019.

  1. Minio

    Minio pfm Member

    Like a lot of the polemic documentaries you see on life in the USA it doesn't show the full story.

    How is it that the people on the lowest incomes in the US have the highest birth rates if the average bill for a baby is 10 grand?

    The system accommodates them in a fiff faff back street sort of way.

    Somehow, everyone else subsidises it involuntarily, which leads to resentment in the middling masses.

    And this contributes to the popularity of Right wing presidents like Trump.
  2. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    I’ve started a thread for it, but just in case anyone would have missed it due to lack of interest in the subject the Turner Prize was quite remarkable this year as the four nominated artists had quietly aligned into a collective prior to the announcement refusing to play the winner/loser game and made a very powerful joint anti-Brexit/anti-Tory/anti-fascist acceptance speech. Worth catching in full on iPlayer when it appears, it was broadcast at 11pm on BBC4.
    jackbarron, Nick_G and TheDecameron like this.
  3. anubisgrau

    anubisgrau pfm Member

    Even NYT got it right:


    "Pity British voters because they are being subjected to a barrage of distortion, dissembling and disinformation without precedent in the country’s history. Long sentimentalized as the home of “fair play,” Britain is now host to the virus of lies, deception and digital skulduggery that afflicts many other countries across the world.

    In this as in other respects, Mr. Johnson — a serial liar who lost his first job as a journalist for inventing quotes — resembles President Trump. And Britain, whose election is breaking down under the pressure of manipulation, increasingly looks like the United States. Truth and falsehood have become malleable concepts. Anything goes."
  4. maxflinn

    maxflinn pfm Member

    The NYT would know all about lies; it prints them daily.
    eternumviti and anubisgrau like this.
  5. Tim Jones

    Tim Jones pfm Member

    Might be a duck/rabbit I guess.
    Sue Pertwee-Tyr likes this.
  6. richgilb

    richgilb Admonishtrator

    Really? What, like by enough of a majority that the people that don't want independence will not be enough in numbers to throw a spanner in the works at every round of talks, every vote, every proposed deal, every step in the divorce?

    How do you know more than me on what the outcome would be? I'd guess 52% yes post-Brexit. Or are you saying the no voters will more likely accept it than the no voters of Brexit have. if so, how do you know that?
  7. Alfie

    Alfie undercover

    You may be right but even so...

    Here's a Quote from a US citizen I took off Facebook - "I am an American and please believe me when I say that you want nothing to do with changing from your NHS to our horrible system! People are dying here because we can't afford medicine or refuse to see a doctor because of the cost associated. Hold onto your NHS with the last ounce of strength in your bodies."
    jackbarron and andrewd like this.
  8. Joe

    Joe pfm Member

  9. Alfie

    Alfie undercover

    The most important thing is the accuracy of the article, not who wrote it.
  10. matthewr

    matthewr spɹɐʍʞɔɐq spɹoɔǝɹ ɹnoʎ sʎɐld

    Because I don't think most people vote against independence because of a deep love of the Act of Union and the United Kingdom or England but because they (correctly, IMHO) believe it will make them worse off in various ways. The problem with Brexit is that it is an idea so lacking in merit that people don't even bother explaining what is good about it let alone explaining how we will overcome it's significant harm.

    This is of course just my opinion and am happy to concede to knowing less about this than you.
  11. Joe

    Joe pfm Member

    And I wasn't commenting on it's veracity ....I was just highlighting/questioning the word "even " in the header.
    Alfie likes this.
  12. Seanm

    Seanm pfm Member

  13. eternumviti

    eternumviti pfm Member

    When it becomes serious, you have to lie.
  14. Joe

    Joe pfm Member

  15. richgilb

    richgilb Admonishtrator

    Where did I suggest you know less than me?

    Religion rears its wonderful head here. Always a good one for a ruck.
  16. matthewr

    matthewr spɹɐʍʞɔɐq spɹoɔǝɹ ɹnoʎ sʎɐld

    I was conceding this point.

    Although, obviously, this was a roundabout way of pointing out that I made no claim to know more about this than you or anyone else and was just expressing my opinion.
  17. Stunsworth

    Stunsworth pfm Member

    Covkxw likes this.
  18. richgilb

    richgilb Admonishtrator

    So, if it is not quite as divisive and emotional etc as Brexit, give a bit ether way in case one of us is right...it's not going to be easy. And it has religious divisions. And it is really a small country. And it might have a very difficult neighbour in England, making the divorce even harder for it. So the turbulence could be much worse in the transition period. Which could mean loss of jobs, reduction in local government funds etc etc. I can't see a smooth, everyone getting along love-in at all. I wonder if it will be even worse than it is with Brexit.
  19. wacko

    wacko pfm Member

    Trump just said "I wouldn't want ..."
    oh hang on he lies constantly so anything he says has zero value.
  20. matthewr

    matthewr spɹɐʍʞɔɐq spɹoɔǝɹ ɹnoʎ sʎɐld

    You make entirely reasonable points!

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