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yesterday I heard the Naim NDS

Discussion in 'audio' started by Rico, Jul 13, 2012.

  1. Blzebub

    Blzebub Banned

    Yes, it's this radical new concept known as "marketing". The only company which does this, is in fact Naim. Whether any alleged "hype" is justified or not, is up to the consumer, and that won't be you.

    Did Paul Stephenson ever do anything bad to you, and if so, do you expect he'll suffer for it in the next imaginary place, as well as this real one?
     
  2. bob atherton

    bob atherton pfm Member

    +1

    Totally agree
     
  3. Robert

    Robert Tapehead

    Easily, from the sonics POV.

    Digital audio is a mature technology, therefore from a purely sonics driven POV you can buy by numbers. It only needs to meet a decent basic specification to sound superb. Presumably it does.

    So I'll know exactly what it'll sound like from a spec sheet. This is not, contrary to popular belief, evidence of my superhuman powers. Anyone can do it.
    Not so for TTs, cartridges, arms, loudspeakers and electromechanical audio equipment in general.

    In this case, I think we have a statement product so I presume in addition to excellent sound it is superbly built, looks great and has the usual backup form a superb company. Add in a little market positioning and there's your price tag. I wish them great success with it.
     
  4. LOTUS HIFI

    LOTUS HIFI LOTUS Hifi


    Ha ha ... so true. :D

    Sometimes I really do wonder which forum is the least unbalanced and most sane, PFM, Wigwam or the Naim forum. It's a tough call. :p
     
  5. Gaius

    Gaius Trade: Stiletto by Tangerine

    Well I agree with all that as well, so there are at least 3 of us!
     
  6. eelmaster

    eelmaster pfm Member

    +1 more

    I'd be really interested to hear what those who have actually heard the NDS think of it and what it compares to. If anyone would be kind enough to put that down, I for one would be grateful.

    The fact that several don't feel inclined to do so is, IMHO, not a good omen for this forum and tells a rather sorry tale of how discussions on a few particular topics have become an increasingly irresistible opportunity for a thread crap by a few people with predictable and repetitive axes to grind.
     
  7. Teddy Ray

    Teddy Ray pfm Member


    i was listening to stevie wonder and had klavinets on the brain. FACT.


    some things just can't make any sonic difference. FACT.

    you can't bend the laws of physics.

    things that dont matter

    "transports" ( i hate that stupid word)



    "dacs" (will all perform the same unless intentionally messed up by valve output, etc)

    SS preamp choice (will be identical as per harbeth)

    cables(speaker, IC, Mains)


    things that do matter

    whats being played

    the room ACOUSTICS(makes a larger impact than *anything* else, anything..which is why it is absurd to spend a lot of money on gear when a fraction of the cost on treatment gives much bigger results--when I see some dude or other post his million dollar system and see that his room is not treated, I cant help but laugh)

    electro-mechanical devices..how they are engineered

    speaker selection

    mental state

    impedence matching

    gain staging

    speaker setup


    outside of those things...the impact is little to ZERO.


    and as far as affording things?? I could, with some wrangling, in the matter of a few months, pretty much get any Hifi piece that I want. It isn't that. It is honestly that ive learned better and how full of shit the industry is, same as with Homeopathy, Religion and Wine.

    There are things that matter, sure. It seems as though many Audiophiles just don't have enough grounding, grasp of the science rudiments to know what they are. ..either that or, Like that *AMAZING JOURNALIST* Fremer, willfully ignore them so as to remain comfortable in their delusions.

    I have suggested books before... Soundrecording/Handbook of recording engineering- Eargle

    Mastering Audio- Katz

    Principles of Digital Audio- Pohlmann

    Digital Audio Explained- Aldrich

    Audio Explained- Winer http://cooltea.com/stores/audio-expert-by-ethan-winer/

    it is simple, really. read books. get smart. save money.
     
  8. Jaspercat

    Jaspercat pfm Member

    So how come when you add the second 555 psu it sounds better - surely the basic numbers remain the same.

    Do you have the specifications? If you go to the Naim website the specs are pretty sparse so how does one take a view on specs alone.

    I am certainly not "selling" the NDS, sure I went to the demo but for me I would need to hear it in my own home with my setup. The problem with the Naim demo is that they used a NAC 252, a NAP 300 - which is fine but the S-600 Ovators they used I dion't like and that spoilt it for me. There was a noticable improvement over the NDX though at least to my ears in that demo room with their setup.

    Worth the money for the top end kit with 2 x 555's and the NDS? not for me as I have my own immediate upgrade plans but if someone wants to invest their hard earned in this and they like the sound and it makes them happy then why not. You can easily lose this much on the first years depreciation on a new car so everything in perspective.
     
  9. Jaspercat

    Jaspercat pfm Member

    Teddy - I can only agree with a small part of your post - you state it all like it is an irrefutable fact BTW - but you are so wrong. For example speaker cables matter hugely, I have just finished a test of the NAC5's against the Chord Silver Screen - I can prove to anyone that the differences are vast with the Chord being in a totally different class for me. Not nuances but a difference in sound anyone could hear.
    We've already had the discussion on DAC's in a previous thread and I never heard your Mytek DAC yet, but the DAC's I did demo (that is a home demo in my friends place with A:B blind etc on top end kit) sounded very different.
    I have a pair of Nordost Baldur RCA's and they are far superior to the Monster cables they replaced.

    If you can't hear the differences I have just alluded to - and the offer still stands if you're ever in the UK to come hear for yourself - then I would have to respectfully conclude that you hearing must be impaired.
     
  10. Suffolk Tony

    Suffolk Tony Aim low, achieve your goals, avoid disappointment.

    So. Seven posts with constructive comment on the original posting, 102 with the usual old guff. Another thread FUBAR.

    Back to the DIY Forum for me.
     
  11. John Channing

    John Channing fruit box forever

    A list of brands I largely know nothing about. What streaming products do these companies produce that are direct competitors for the NDS?
     
  12. Mr Magoo

    Mr Magoo I prefer spots.

    Saw the title of the original post and immediately felt a deep foreboding (and sympathy for the poster). A perfectly reasonable post for what is a music and hi-fi forum a reasonable person might think?? How wrong. Out come the Naim Slayers again.

    What's really worrying is that some say they dare not post opinions or views about Naim on PFM. Now isn't that something we should all be concerned about, Naim fans or not?

    Shameful really.
     
  13. DSCOTT

    DSCOTT pfm Member

    I thought Wine and Audio (Music) went well together.

    At least Fremer has a sense of humor.
     
  14. dave

    dave Plywood King

    Mr. Magoo,

    It's not just the Naim bashing by a few warped individuals who feel they've been personally wronged by Naim but a bigger problem with an increasing number of religious zealots who constantly disrupt conversations shouting down folks who don't uphold their belief that only room acoustics and speakers explain hifi differences past a certain point.

    Rico,

    So your CDS3 might be mothballed ehh? ;-)

    regards,

    dave
     
  15. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    Temporarily closed for a prune....
     
  16. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    <moderating>

    To be honest I can't work out how to prune it, so I haven't - I hate moderation! I am however conscious that some feel they are bludgeoned to death when they try to express an opinion or enter into a discussion about a product, which is rather odd given this is an audio forum.

    This clearly leaves me with a problem. The easy option is to do what a lot of forums do and to have a strong editorial policy / gang-hut mentality, i.e. brand the site as either an subjectivist or objectivist forum or whatever. I really don't want to do this as I don't see it is my place to tell the rest of you what to think. I know where I lie on the spectrum (what I see as a rational and logical subjectivist, right in the middle of the two extremes), but I'm not going to get all preachy about anything, and the last thing I'd ever do is to make a comment about things like this Naim device as a) I have no idea what it actually is, and b) I've never heard one. I would however ask that folk show a little respect to other viewpoints and not bang the same simplistic agenda points over and over again. In fact I think it would be best if threads such as this were left to those who had direct experience of the products at hand. The rest is, as they say, noise.

    Please also consider how any given post may appear to newcomers, folk arriving here for the first time via a web search etc. I need to keep this place friendly and first impressions count for a lot.
     
  17. dave

    dave Plywood King

    Thanks for the response Tony which addressed my new thread in some ways. I really don't envy your job nor do I have a clue how we're going to fix this without a loss unless we each just take responsibility for our own posts before we hit the submit button.
     
  18. DSCOTT

    DSCOTT pfm Member

    Tony, I think you did the right thing and your post is spot on. In general I think the balance is pretty good on PFM (and this is what makes it interesting and enjoyable), nevertheless your comment "I would however ask that folk show a little respect to other viewpoints and not bang the same simplistic agenda points over and over again" bears repeating.
     
  19. Mr Magoo

    Mr Magoo I prefer spots.

    Dave

    Then surely a DIY or home design forums would be more suitable for such folk. It does seem odd that people who refuse to recognise differences in most audio equipment would frequent audio forums as they have surely discovered audio nirvana?



    Now is anyone prepared to join a discussion on the NDS? After all, there are many who would be very interested to hear more about this new product.
     
  20. naimsg

    naimsg pfm Member

    Anyone has compared NDS/555 with KDS/1, CDS3/555 or CD555/555? :)
     

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